The Wrasslin Thread!

[AlucardsFate]

This will either be a moderate success or a miserable failure, but it seems we have at least one new person who is a wrestling fan. So we shall see how it turns out, worst case scenario it just turns into Brian and I bantering back and forth.

So all us wrestling fans have a nice place to talk about WWE, TNA...old stuff, whatever!

(Told you I'd get around to it...but like all things, it takes me several months)

Favorite (Current) WWE Wrestler: The Miz (http://www.wwe.com/superstars/raw/themiz/)

Favorite TNA: Daffney (http://www.tnawrestling.com/roster/superstar-roster/item/1616-daffney) (Even though I never, ever get to see her. She has a demented little chokehold on my heart. And it says something about TNA...that my favorite person is a girl...who is never on TV.)

Favorite (All Time): Bret "The Hitman" Hart (http://www.wwe.com/superstars/halloffame/inductees/brethart/)

Other Favorites (Current): Chris Jericho, Sheamus, "Dashing" Cody Rhodes, John Morrison, CM Punk, Christian, Kane.

Other Favorites (All Time): Mr.Perfect, Randy Savage, Shawn Michaels, The Undertaker, Steve Austin, The Rock, JBL, Ted Dibiase, Owen Hart, Chris Benoit, 90's Goldust (used to be awesome), Matt Hardy.

*I hope I didn't miss anyone...

Also let it be known that I heartily despise John Cena. Though I'm not the one who chants "Cena sucks" during his matches. I go to the bathroom during them. But right now is a really great time for me...THE MIZ IS THE CHAMPION. Finally an awesome, deserving champion. I'm more interested in WWE television right now then I have been in awhile. (And tonight was great...Jerry almost did it! But he got out-awesomed) WWE's biggest...(and longest running) flaw however remains. The women's division. They have a few good ladies but use them all wrong (Or in Maryse's case...never use them) I swear to God if I see Alicia Fox one more time I'm going to stab myself with a pen. Outside of that WWE is the same as it ever was, fluctuating gradually in quality, but never dropping below the the red line. (hitting it a few times maybe...) Right now, it's AWESOME.

TNA...oh TNA...just when you were finding your footing and things were actually getting GOOD...Hulk Hogan comes along and fucks it right up. I have a REALLY hard time even paying attention to TNA now. (Doesn't help that 30mins of it runs right through 30Rock...the best thing on TV) Angles that go nowhere...some that you forget about, schizophrenic writing at it's ugliest, filled with pointless, annoying promos all over the damn place. (Not that WWE isn't guilty of this sin as well, but usually theirs are short at least...USUALLY.) They take all their really good people, and fire/shut them away. (Christopher Daniels fired, AJ Styles given a pointless belt and shuffled away, Daffney comes out to go through some kind of table every 6 months then they forget about her) The place is a damn mess, I'm only even vaguely sure what's going on now. BUT at least they put on a decent match or two...when they remember to put on a match.

How about everyone else? (or just Bri, even though I know a portion of his answers anyway)

[Heiae]

Oh man, so many names I recognize and loved. I used to watch the HELL out of some wrestling when I was little.

[Ed209]

I don't watch wrestling anymore. I dunno who is around anymore, but I can talk about the good old days.

Favorite all time:The Road Warriors (before they went to WWF)

Other Faves: Ricky "the Dragon" Steamboat, "Superfly" Jimmy Snukka, Sting (pre-goth), The Great Muta, Brutus Beefcake, Mr. Perfect, Ravishing Rick Rude, Ted DiBiase, and Razor Ramon

Least Favorite: Brother Love (he was a manager, and if you know who he is, you'd hate him too), Paul Bearer, Hakeem the african dream, the big boss man, Shawn Michaels, Doink the Clown, Bad News Brown, Rick Flair, Triple H, Yokozuna, "The Model" Rick Martel, Jake the Snake Roberts.

[Scion_of_Life]

Current Favorite: Rey Mysterio, Randy Orton

Least Favorite: Johnny Nitro, Kane, John Cena, Big Show

All Time Faves: Goldberg, Undertaker, Gail Kim

[SnakeEyez]

Favorite Wrestler: AJ Styles
Favorite Tag Team: The Motor City Machine Guns
Favorite Female Wrestler: Daffney

Other Favorites: John Morrison, CM Punk, "The Pope" D'Angelo Dinero, Velvet Sky, Ebetaro, Sheamus, Christopher Daniels, Samoa Joe, The Miz, James Storm, Melina, El Generico, Shelton Benjamin, Daniel Bryan, Kurt Angle, and Roxxi Laveaux

I follow WWE and TNA the best that I can without cable (thank you, Internet). They both do terribly stupid things sometimes, but I like both companies anyway. I try to keep up with Ring of Honor as well, but it's a bit more difficult.

I've come to really enjoy CM Punk on commentary. This past Monday when John Cena was clearing off the announce table to throw Heath Slater into it, Punk yelled, "What are you doing, Cena?! This isn't the Spanish announce table!" I laughed for a minute straight.

[AlucardsFate]

Yeah, Punk was pretty good. Still being kind of a dick but offering INTELLIGENT banter. It reminds me of when JBL was on the announce table. (Telling Cole to shut his piehole)

Ed you didn't love Brother Love? (he was all apple cheeked all the time!) HE SURE LOVES YOU!

Scion...Gail Kim is an odd choice. I never saw the big deal with her to be honest...I've seen her do a lot of fun moonsaults and flips but have no grasp of the basics, but whatever. I'm far more concerned with Goldberg. That's a...choice...I'm actually curious to hear more about that. To me Goldberg was always 98% presence with no real talent. (And I hear he's an asshole. Though Bret Hart says differently...says he's actually a really good guy. Who knows!?)

[Runepop]

Se I think I can help with your Information on all Wrestling matters even the occasional spoiler. Its called The Wrestling Game yes it is a game but the home page has all the latest news.

*I have not been Watching wrestling for long only a couple years so my list does not contain many classics*
Wrestler : Rey Mysterio
Diva: Kelly Kelly
Tag Team: D-Generation X
Other Favorite Wrestlers: Tripple H,HBK Shawn Micheals , Kofi Kingston, Jeff and Matt Hardy, CM Punk, MVP, Shamus, Evan Bourne, Christian, Stone Cold,, And theres more.
Other Fav Tag teams: Cryme Time, Hardy Boys

[RedWizard]

Hmm...

Performers I like: Rowdy Roddy Piper, Gorilla Monsoon, The Road Warriors (Hawk & Animal), Sergeant Slaughter, Andre the Giant, Ultimo Dragon (when he was ya know, good), The Undertaker (when he dressed like one with the purple gloves and tie), Jerry "the King" Lawler, and uh... I dunno. The Million Dollar Man.

Performers I'm sorta indifferent to: Rey Mysterio, Cactus Jack, Dude Love, Mankind, anyone else fueled by Mick Foley, The Headbangers (Mosh & Thrasher), that one guy whose name I forgot, and Kane.

Performers me disgusta: Carlito, Hunter Hearst Helmsley, Edge, Viscera, Batista, Ric Flair, Kurt Angle, Shawn Michaels, Eric Bischoff, Scott Steiner, and Vader.

Performers I'll always remember, despite WWE's insistence that they don't exist: Chris Benoit.

[AlucardsFate]

Ed...you don't like Shawn Micheals? REALLY!? I am a Bret Hart fan above all else...and I still even love to watch Shawn Micheals. Very few people can turn "it" on at will like HBK.

[Scion_of_Life]

Ed...you don't like Shawn Micheals? REALLY!? I am a Bret Hart fan above all else...and I still even love to watch Shawn Micheals. Very few people can turn "it" on at will like HBK.

Isn't Shawn Michaels retired? I was looking at the WWE website and Shawn Michaels wasn't listed as a superstar.

[AlucardsFate]

Isn't Shawn Michaels retired? I was looking at the WWE website and Shawn Michaels wasn't listed as a superstar.

Yup, he retired at Wrestlemania this year. Which is fine, I'd rather see him go out when he's still awesome...with class, then to Hulk Hogan us all forever. He was a big part of some really good times...and my favorite match ever. (Shawn Michaels vs Bret Hart "Iron Man Match" at WM12)

[Scion_of_Life]

Well, I have to agree that the Iron Man match with Bret Hart is one of my favorite matches of all time. Still, it sucks that most of the superstars that defined an era have left the WWE already. Most of the new guys suck.

[Ed209]

Ed...you don't like Shawn Micheals? REALLY!? I am a Bret Hart fan above all else...and I still even love to watch Shawn Micheals. Very few people can turn "it" on at will like HBK.

Shawn Michaels was a douche. I never liked the whole HBK persona and I hated him even more when the whole DX thing started. I hate him most of all because he helped Vince McMahon fuck Brett Hart over. He was talented, but I couldn't stand him.

[AlucardsFate]

Shawn Michaels was a douche. I never liked the whole HBK persona and I hated him even more when the whole DX thing started. I hate him most of all because he helped Vince McMahon fuck Brett Hart over. He was talented, but I couldn't stand him.

Well I'm the biggest Hart fan, but I still recognize the absurd level of talent HBK has. Besides...Bret isn't holding that grudge anymore. Why should I when I haven't met either of them? I like McMahon too, he's done a lot for wrestling in general despite what you think of him. And when he decides to appear, he is still one of the best "characters" around.

[SnakeEyez]

Oh yeah, I forgot to list my least favorite wrestlers/personalities.

Triple H
Michelle McCool
Bobby Lashley
Alicia Fox
Rob Terry
The Mediocre Khali
Michael Cole
Post-1994 Hulk Hogan

[AlucardsFate]

Oh we can do that can't we...I however can't bring myself to hate Triple H. I hate things that he does as far as his behind the scenes "presence" goes but I cannot deny that he is almost every bit as good as he says he is. Though nowadays he doesn't try either because he's getting older or he just doesn't care to. But back when he was "Hunter Hearst Helmsley" and in his rise to dominance in the Attitude era...he was indeed That Damn Good. I remember him that way.

Anyway, who I HATE (I dislike many, but this is a special list):

Alicia Fox: It's a fact that MOST of the WWE lady wrestlers aren't actual WRESTLERS. This applies x4 for Alicia. She is the absolute clumsiest performer I've seen since...well since this person:

Scott Stiener: Now, Scott is better then Alicia for one reason. His inability to master the English language makes his interviews...unintentionally hilarious. Otherwise, he is another clumsy mess.

R-Truth: Ya know what's sad? Truth isn't a horrible wrestler...he probably is actually good. But I'll never get to find out because instead of putting together good matches full of variety, he is a consummate spot monkey. (This means for the confused, that he pretty much does nothing but wait to use his "signature" moves. And this is all he ever does. For the worst example of this see "The Road Dogg" Jesse James) That alone is not enough to make me despise Truth. But his entrance theme, good God it's horrible. I bet your surprised to know, that every time he comes out, I kill one endangered animal just so I can say that something MORE horrible then his entrance occurred that day. I hate it that much.

John Cena: Again...TOTAL spot monkey. but for some reason everyone loves him. I don't get it. I never will.

Zack Ryder: Please explain your existence. You can't? Neither can I.

Michael Cole: It's amazing that it took them this long to figure out that EVERYONE hates Cole. Now, every commentator gaffs sometimes...says something stupid. It happens. But Cole does it...about 10 times...a night. AND HE HAS BEEN AROUND FOR MORE THEN A DECADE.

Matt Striker: He started as a bad wrestler. Then he became a mediocre commentator. He didn't say anything remarkable but he wasn't annoying. THEN he decided EVERY NIGHT I WILL MAKE UP A NEW STUPID NICKNAME FOR EVERYONE I SEE. Now he just needs to shut the hell up.

Hornswoggle: Finlay was a fun to watch Irish bruiser. Then you ruined him. Thanks jackass. You serve no useful purpose. Now go away please.

Hulk Hogan (Post 1998): I think 94 is a little harsh. The NWO thing was great for awhile...until it got out of hand. Now Hogan just won't go away and he has nothing to offer the business. His intervention in TNA wrestling has taken what was an up and coming alternative organization...and sent it back to the dark ages. It's 1 step from unwatchable now. Thanks Hulk. Go away please.

That is all I can think of right now...

[RedWizard]

Hey! I totally remembered the name of that guy whose name I forgot!

Guy whose name I forgot: Booker T.

[Ed209]

You know who I used to hate? In the 80's there was this wrestler in the WWF called "the Genius". He was this complete freakin' gay stereotype. In real life he's the Macho Man Randy Savage's brother.

Also, Scott Steiner needs to lay off the steroids. He looks ridiculous.

Who remembers the 20 man Battle Royal from Wrestlemania 2 which featured wrestlers and NFL players? It was awesome. Ah, the good old days.

[Scion_of_Life]

And, if I remember correctly, the NFL guys got there asses handed to them. That's the way it should be.

[AlucardsFate]

Seems we got a lot of old school wrasslin fans in here. But how many of you still watch today? I'm just curious.

[RedWizard]

They still show wrestling on TV?

[SnakeEyez]

No, they only show "sports entertainment" these days.

[Runepop]

WWE pisses me off a lot sometimes there are so many good wrestlers in their roster but they absolutely refuse to push them because of people like John Cena. They don't want their "poster boy" out of the spot light. Examples being Mark Henery, Evan "air" Bourne Etc. I was shocked when Shamis became champion so soon. And Miz becoming champion at all he's a good wrestler but my lord he is annoying as can freaking be.

[AlucardsFate]

The Miz is your champion and you will respect his awesomeness! The best champion we have had the privileged of having in some time.

But WWE does push their younger guys a bit, more on Smackdown though. It isn't the show where anything happens...but it's more fun to watch because the matches are better.

[Runepop]

Very true Al. And really I prefer having Miz as a new champion then continue to see the same people over and over again . How long was it that the only two people you saw in the title chase be Orton, Cena then they added Shamus then even he started to get boring.

Honestly my only problem with the Miz is that mouth of his if he could take that down about 5 notches then there is nothing for me to despise.

But I must agree he is the only Champion that is actually interesting because everyone else has had it so much its nearly impossible to be interested anymore.

[AlucardsFate]

Wha? HIS MOUTH IS HIS GREATEST WEAPON!

[Runepop]

You mean great annoyance. If I wanted to hear a champion run him mouth it should of stayed in the age of Orton. At least then It didn't give me a headache. (I mean that literally I honestly get a Migraine listening to him.)

LOL well we can at least agree to disagree on this matter.

[AlucardsFate]

You mean great annoyance. If I wanted to hear a champion run him mouth it should of stayed in the age of Orton. At least then It didn't give me a headache. (I mean that literally I honestly get a Migraine listening to him.)

LOL well we can at least agree to disagree on this matter.

I suppose we COULD. But that's not what I'm about.

I guess your just not awesome enough to hear The Miz. That sir is the cause of your migraines...your brain can't take all that awesome.

[AlucardsFate]

BLOW! I saw this and though everyone might enjoy it.

http://www.cracked.com/article_18918_the-9-most-unintentionally-depressing-pro-wrestling-gimmicks.html

EDIT: Why the hell did I start that with "Blow"? I'm gonna leave that because it's so incredibly stupid. But I had just woke up when I found this. (I had a VERY late night last night)

[Scion_of_Life]

Very true Al. And really I prefer having Miz as a new champion then continue to see the same people over and over again . How long was it that the only two people you saw in the title chase be Orton, Cena then they added Shamus then even he started to get boring.

Honestly my only problem with the Miz is that mouth of his if he could take that down about 5 notches then there is nothing for me to despise.

But I must agree he is the only Champion that is actually interesting because everyone else has had it so much its nearly impossible to be interested anymore.

The Miz may run his mouth, but he keeps us entertained while he does so. Guys like Orton, Cena, and Mr. Kennedy just need to shut their mouths and get hit in the head repeatedly with a baseball bat. Although, Orton actually has some wrestling skill.

[SnakeEyez]

Oh hell no.

http://www.wwe.com/inside/news/kavalreleased

[AlucardsFate]

Oh hell no.

http://www.wwe.com/inside/news/kavalreleased

Yeah I know. I'm not sure what was going on there....
It does seem like they were having trouble finding a place for him though.

[SnakeEyez]

Oh, they had a place for him: bottom of the barrel. With the exception of that one victory over Ziggler, they had him lose every single match on Smackdown. They turned him into a jobber. They made him look like a joke...and then they fired him. That's BS. Kaval is way too good to be treated like a no-talent chump. They didn't even give him a chance.

Yeah, I know talented wrestlers are released all the time, but I am really unhappy about this one.

[AlucardsFate]

Well it's a place that a lot of guys have fallen into over in Connecticut over the years. I always thought that Shelton Benjamin was way better then they ever gave him credit for. (And he proved it on Raw in that one really great match he had with HBK) Kaval had the same problem that Benjamin and people like Lance Storm had...they have the personality of a doorknob. And in WWE, promos are important which is why people like MVP and John Cena who could work the mic and nothing else were able to get noticed.

But hey, I saw that AJ Styles says that TNA should sign him. I totally agree! The only problem for him down there would be that TNA doesn't have the TV space for what they have right now, much less anyone new. He may get lost in the shuffle. Though were TNA to thin out the unnecessary bits from there show now...that would be a different story. He may be better off in Ring of Honor, their roster actually seems pretty tiny. But then again the show is only an hour long so maybe I only see certain people.

But it is too bad, Kaval was damn good in the ring and we certainly needed the diversity. Mysterio is their only real high-flyer since Evan Bourne can't not get hurt the second he returns. Smackdown especially, their huge problem is that they don't have a wide variety of people to see, but I actually on the whole like it better because it's more (And better) matches a lot of the time. (Mid carders try way harder) They could have put Kaval on a tag team or something. They need more teams...Or put him over by having him beat Drew McIntyire...that woulda been surprising enough to get noticed...

Oh well...

[SnakeEyez]

You know what we need? Some end-of-the-year wrestling awards. Let's talk about the best and worst wrestling moments from 2010.

I pulled these criteria from the Wrestling Observer Newsletter's yearly awards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Wrestling_Observer_Newsletter_awards) and omitted or altered a couple categories where necessary. So, wrestling fans, I'd like to hear your thoughts on the winners for the following categories:

Best Feud/Rivalry of the Year
Worst Feud/Rivalry of the Year
Tag Team of the Year
Most Improved Wrestler
Best Promos/Interviews
Most Overrated Wrestler
Most Underrated Wrestler
Best Non-Wrestler Personality
Best Wrestling Announcer
Worst Wrestling Announcer
Best Wrestling Move
Female Wrestler of the Year
Male Wrestler of the Year
Match of the Year

My choices are...

Best Feud/Rivalry of the Year: John Cena vs. The Nexus
Runner-up: CM Punk vs. Rey Mysterio
The entire Nexus saga has been one of the best storylines that the WWE has ever produced, in my opinion. From the moment they debuted and demolished the ring, they've been an interesting and integral part of Monday Night Raw. Wade Barrett has been portrayed fantastically as an evil mastermind, and his attempts to subvert Cena have been very fun to watch. For a group of untested fresh-faced rookies, The Nexus has done a good job of making an impact and staying fresh and interesting week after week. Cena, too, has been excellent in his role. His never-say-die attitude is a great foil to the Nexus' relentless attempts to chop him down to size. Even now, months later, this feud between Cena and the Nexus remains as engaging and interesting as the day it all began. Hats off to WWE creative for coming up with such a great rivalry.

Worst Feud/Rivalry of the Year: Kane vs. Edge
Runner-up: Jay Lethal vs. Robbie E
Kane was frigging awesome over the summer. His career had been rekindled and he had finally, finally received his long-overdue chance to carry Smackdown as the World Heavyweight Champion after languishing in midcard purgatory for close to a decade. His feud with the Undertaker was exemplary, and with Paul Bearer in his corner, Kane looked unstoppable. Then Edge entered the picture and Kane's momentum nosedived. The entire Paul Bearer kidnapping angle was just so insipid and tedious that I could have sworn I was watching WCW circa 2000. They really expected me to believe that big bad Kane -- the evil genius who plotted the demise of the legendary Undertaker and caused absolute chaos and havoc on Smackdown for months on end -- was reduced to a whiny, sniveling crybaby once his dear sweet daddy was taken away from him? He could maul The Undertaker and leave him in a coma for months but he couldn't muster the energy to catch Edge wheeling around a 300-pound man for weeks on end? The entire feud was just unbelievably bad.

Tag Team of the Year: The Motor City Machine Guns
Runner-up: Beer Money, Inc.
These guys are awesome. After tagging together for several years, they finally won the TNA Tag Titles for the first time this year. Since then, they've had excellent matches with Beer Money, Team 3D, and Generation Me. Throughout it all, they've managed to bring a whole new level of pulse-pounding excitement to all of their matches. It also doesn't hurt that they are absolutely phenomenal in the ring. I can't say enough good things about the Guns. They've really dominated the tag team division this year.

Most Improved Wrestler: Sheamus
Runner-up: The Miz
At the beginning of 2010, Sheamus was the WWE Champion after scoring a fluke victory over John Cena in a tables match. It wasn't clear whether this was the beginning of a prosperous career or if he was just going to be some flash-in-the-pan champion who would descend back into mediocrity once his reign was over. (Hello there, Jack Swagger.) Over the past year, Sheamus has really made the most of the opportunities given to him and improved by leaps and bounds. He's a two-time WWE Champion, he's the 2010 King of the Ring, and he's had some great matches and rivalries with guys like John Cena, Triple H, Randy Orton, and John Morrison. He's really come a long way in a short amount of time.

Best Promos/Interviews: The Miz
Runner-up: CM Punk
This one was a really tough decision between CM Punk and Miz. In the end, I went with the Miz because his promos come straight from the heart. You can feel the passion and the emotion every time he talks about how he clawed his way up the ladder and proved all of his doubters wrong. Whenever Miz has a microphone, you know good things are going to happen.

Most Overrated Wrestler: Alicia Fox
Runner-up: Rob Terry
This was another tough choice. I had it narrowed down to Rob Terry and Alicia Fox, but I went with Alicia Botch in the end because Rob Terry has done at least one thing that impressed me (when he took that unprotected chair shot straight to the head from Homicide and didn't even flinch, I thought that was pretty badass). Alicia Fox is one of the worst female wrestlers I've ever seen, but the WWE insisted on pushing her anyway for reasons I simply cannot fathom. She beat numerous divas who were far more talented than her and even carried the Diva's Championship for a couple months. I know WWE's women's division is laughable, but that was a low point even for them.

Most Underrated Wrestler: Kaval
Runner-up: Desmond Wolfe
So much wasted potential. Kaval is incredibly entertaining to watch in the ring. His offense is so unique and his moves are so crisp that you can always expect to see something special every time he steps through the ropes. And yet, WWE apparently thought it was necessary to turn him into a jobber, have him lose just about every single match he was in, and then release him without warning because they had no long-term plans for him. Kaval has the talent to be a big deal in the WWE, but they squandered his talents big time.

Best Non-Wrestler Personality: Vickie Guerrero
Runner-up: Mick Foley
I am consistently amazed at just how much the crowd hates Vickie Guerrero. With one well-place "Excuse Me," she can send the fans into an uproar of boos. With the exception of Eric Escobar (who had the personality of a turnip), Vickie has been able to bring a ton of heat to whomever she is paired up with. This year, she was able to help LayCool and Dolph Ziggler garner more heat from the fans simply by hanging around them. Hell, I'm convinced that she is the only reason Kaitlin won season three of NXT. Vickie Guerrero is extremely good at what she does.

Best Wrestling Announcer: Josh Matthews
Runner-up: Matt Striker
Josh Matthews has been surprisingly good on commentary this year. No matter who he's working with -- Michael Cole, Matt Striker, Todd Grisham, or even Lawler and Punk -- he always does a good job meshing with his broadcast partner and adapting to their commentating style. He's funny, he's sarcastic, he's cynical, and he actually calls the action in the ring as well. Matthews has been fantastic at the announce booth this year.

Worst Wrestling Announcer: Michael Cole
Runner-up: Mike Tenay
Oh, Cole, where do I begin. His catchphrases are painfully annoying, he never calls the action in the ring, he says complete nonsense at least once per match, he botches the names of half the wrestlers' signature moves, and he spends so much time shining the spotlight on himself that he never gets around to putting over the talent in the ring -- which, if I'm not mistaken, is the main objective of a wrestling announcer. You still suck, Cole.

Best Wrestling Move: The Ass Punch (Beef Wellington)
Runner-up: Springboard 450 Splash (AJ Styles)
Watch this (http://www.youtube.com/?v=HTrBYAJTMQs). Devastating. Absolutely devastating.

Female Wrestler of the Year: Madison Rayne
Runner-up: Natalya
How good has Madison Rayne been this past year? She went from being a lackey for the Beautiful People to being one of the most dominating women's champions in TNA history. Not only is she solid in the ring, but she's excellent on the microphone as well. She has blossomed into an excellent all-around wrestler in no time at all.

Male Wrestler of the Year: John Cena
Runner-up: The Miz
You know, I'll give the devil his due: John Cena has had an amazing year. He battled Batista in the main event of Wrestlemania and went on to have an excellent feud with Batista that lasted throughout the summer. He briefly rekindled his old rivalry with Randy Orton and even helped Sheamus get over as a legitimate champion. However, his best work this year has definitely been his rivalry with The Nexus. In just a few short months, Cena has been instrumental in taking a group of nobodies and turning them into stars. Not too many wrestlers are capable of doing that. He has helped Wade Barrett become a major player and has really shown a lot of emotion during his repeated efforts to stand up against the Nexus. Cena has had one hell of a year, and I can think of no other wrestler that has accomplished as much as he has in 2010.

Match of the Year: The Motor City Machine Guns vs. Beer Money (Best 2 out of 3 Falls Match)
Runner-up: Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels (Wrestlemania XXVI)
These two teams had a tremendous feud over the TNA Tag Team Titles over the summer. They had a Best 3 out of 5 series that included a ladder match, a street fight, a steel cage match, and an Ultimate X match -- all of which were excellent in their own right. Their final showdown was a Best 2 out of 3 Falls match that tore the house down. All four wrestlers really pulled out all the stops to put on a truly unforgettable tag team match. Yes, Shawn Michaels vs. Undertaker seems to be the most popular choice for Match of the Year, but for my money, that distinction definitely belongs to the Guns and Beer Money.


Phew! Okay, now it's your turn. :D

[AlucardsFate]

OOOHHH! Awards! Unfortunately my memory isn't able to remember everything that happened this year. It's just awful that way, but I'll do the best I can!
Best Feud/Rivalry of the Year: (Cm Punk vs Rey Mysterio) I'm gonna have to disagree with you a bit her Bri. Cena vs Nexus, I suppose was entertaining and all, but they TOTALLY botched the whole "John Cena Fired" thing. (They really did F*** it up bad) While the Punk/Mysterio fued was entertaining end to end. Everything Punk touches turns to gold so I have high hopes for a strong rebound for the Nexus.

Worst Feud/Rivalry of the Year: (John Morrison vs Sheamus) Edge vs Kane was kind of stupid sure, but it was very WRESTLING stupid. I'm willing to accept that as passable. Trying to sell John Morrison as Spider-Man however...is just retarded. (almost Paul Burchill as Jack Sparrow retarded) This eventually ended in a nice match at King of the Ring, but that was just the talent of the two shining through. The LOWEST moment of this was the Morrison parkour montage through the backstage area. I was laughing as I died a little inside.

Tag Team of the Year: I don't really watch TNA...and does the WWE have Tag Teams? I'm abstaining from this one...Unless "The British Bulldogs" are an acceptable answer.

Most Improved Wrestler: (Sheamus) Okay we can agree here. After one REALLY low point where Sheamus ran like a girl from the Nexus, he stepped it back up and even now is REALLY learning how to work the crowd on the mic and off.

Best Promos/Interviews: (The Miz) Yeah...we can definitely agree here too. Ever since his Money in the Bank, The Miz has been spitting gold from those lips. He's got kind of a Chris Jericho quality to him in some ways. Once he get's his ring chops to that level he will be unstoppable.
Runner Up: Cody Rhodes (Those grooming tips segments kill me. He's really taken an incredibly stupid character idea and turned it into something good. "Don't hit me in the face!" His mic segment in the UK on Smackdown was GREAT. )

Most Overrated Wrestler: (John Cena) What everyone sees in you...I will never know. You will get this award forever until you retire. (I like your pick of Alicia Fox btw, but I wasn't aware that she was even rated....)

Most Underrated Wrestler: (Daffney) TNA won't use her...for anything...ever. Despite the fact that she is literally made from 100% awesome. I can't recall ever seeing another girl willing to do what she's willing to do and do it so damn well. She's got a good gimmick, talent and miles of dedication. WHAT THE HELL ELSE DO YOU NEED TNA!? (I can see Kaval too...but I think they recognized that he was gifted with in ring ability...just not in personality. He needs a hook. And I don't think it was their choice to release him, I understand that he wanted out, though I could be wrong. This IS the internet)
Runner Up: Matt Hardy (I can't pick him anymore (As I would every year for this category...as he ain't wrasslin anymore!)
Runner Up #2: Christian (He's hurt...so it wouldn't be fair to pick him either. Were he active...absolutely.)

Best Non-Wrestler Personality: *Can I pick CM Punk the commentator? No? Then you are right... (Vickie Gurrerro) God I hate Vickie. But that is exactly why she wins. She executes her role consistently well every week. Can't ask for much more then that. (And she sets a crowd off like nobody else)

Best Wrestling Announcer: *But I can pick CM Punk for this! (CM Punk) He may have only been commentating for a very short period of time but he was more entertaining in that time then any of them were all year. Go Punk go!
Runner Up: Jim Ross (Who has called at least one match this year) I will always have a soft spot for good ol JR and nothing is the same without him. A man with catchphrases and isms that you don't find annoying and personality to spare...all while intelligently and concisely calling the action.

Worst Wrestling Announcer: (Matt Striker) Goddammit I've gone from finding Striker endearing in small doses to absolutely abhorring every time he opens his damn mouth. YOU CAN'T GIVE 40 DIFFERENT NICKNAMES TO THE SAME GUY. He just needs to shut the hell up.
Runner Up: Michael Cole Does Cole still suck? Absolutely. But he's embracing his role as the "heel" commentator pretty well. (And it's something we haven't had for years and we do need back) Not to mention he's actually...pretty okay at it. (He's no Bobby Heenan but really...who is?) He is supposed to be annoying now. I can deal with that.

Best Wrestling Move: (The Sharpshooter - Bret Hart) Because I'm a biased piece of crap. Hahahaha.
Runner Up: The Miz reversing the INVINCIBLE RKO into a Skull Crushing Finale...I loved that.

Female Wrestler of the Year: (Laycool) They count as one. Since I haven't been watching TNA all year. (Thanks for killing it Hulk) Though I don't remember their women's division being all that it was the last time I DID watch it. (Though I did see Rayne once this year...and screeching and yelling "Bitch" over and over doesn't constitute GOOD. But that's all I saw of her this year. I couldn't make it past Mickie James' entrance theme without changing the channel.) So I gotta go with what I know! And Laycool has been on fire...they are the single driving force behind whatever women's division the WWE can even claim to have. Without them the entire works would fall apart. They won't use Maryse. Natalya can wrestle...but not talk. They won't use Beth....and Melina can't really stay healthy. Everyone else is kinda...well terrible. Laycool keeps that title afloat. And that match they had where Layla was still wearing a mic was GREAT. "GET AWAY FROM MY FRIEND!" 2 people keeping an entire segment of the show alive by themselves is worthy of acknowledging. (Layla makes me laugh...she is so...cartoonish)

Male Wrestler of the Year: *We aren't friends anymore Bri...All of Cena's matches are exactly the same... (The Miz) The Miz has turned into a superstar...and he's done it the old fashioned way. Not a crazy rapid push like they are so fond of doing, but the way they did it in the old days. He's fought his way through every area of the show and cut his teeth and gotten so much better every month. And watching it all come to a head with this title victory...it was the first title victory I can really say I was crazy excited since...hell I can't even remember. (And the title match this Mon...I am equally excited for)

Match of the Year: (Undertaker vs HBK Part 2) No surprises there. While I don't think it was as good as the first one, it was still just...phenomenal. (And it proved why HBK is as revered as he is...he can always "turn it on" at will...at any age) And the ending was unexpected...fitting and fantastic. *That MCMG/Beer Money match must have been SOME MATCH...I mean...Jesus must have come down during it or something. I can't help but think your a little biased. Not that the MCMG aren't good...because they are damn good. But I've never cared for Beer Money.
Did you hear that the WWE apparently signed Awesome Kong? As long as they use her, this can only be a good thing. She's obviously not there for the Diva calender...which leaves only wrestling.

[SnakeEyez]

I shouldn't have to defend my choices since they were my own personal picks for the best/worst of the year. However, I feel I do need to respond to two things.

Male Wrestler of the Year: *We aren't friends anymore Bri...All of Cena's matches are exactly the same...
Which is relevant...how, exactly? This category wasn't just a measure of wrestling ability. If it was, I would have picked someone like Daniel Bryan or Kurt Angle or someone else who always manages to have a good match no matter what. No, this category was more all-inclusive than that. I asked myself, "Who has accomplished the most in this year?" and went from there. That's why I chose John Cena even though his in-ring work remains lackluster. In my view, no other wrestler in WWE or TNA has accomplished more than he has in 2010. Look at all the things he's done this year -- all the matches, all the storylines, all the title shots, all the title defenses, all the talent he's put over, all the promos he's done. He has done more in 2010 than any other wrestler. That's why he gets my nod for Wrestler of the Year. (I considered calling this category "Superstar of the Year" just to open it up a bit and suggest that the category should take more than just wrestling ability into consideration, but I hate Vince McMahon's buzzwords and try to avoid using them whenever possible.)

*That MCMG/Beer Money match must have been SOME MATCH...I mean...Jesus must have come down during it or something. I can't help but think your a little biased. Not that the MCMG aren't good...because they are damn good. But I've never cared for Beer Money.

Biased? In what way? Because I'm a fan of the Motor City Machine Guns? I like them because they put on good matches. Is it really so surprising that a team that consistently has good matches is involved in the Match of the Year? I don't see how that makes me biased.

The reason the MCMG/Beer Money match won the Match of the Year designation from me is because it was a good match. It was exciting, it was fast-paced, it told a good story, it had a hot crowd, it was given a good amount of time, and everyone involved played their respective parts to perfection. It was the perfect storm of all things awesome crashing down into one incredible match. I really really wish I could just link to the match so you can see for yourself, but I cannot find it anywhere. I originally watched it on Youtube, but that video has long since been removed. Just take my word for it. HBK vs. Undertaker was incredible, no doubt, but the MCMG/Beer Money match entertained me more. And really, isn't that the whole point of wrestling? To be entertained? When I was thinking of my Match of the Year, that's really the only criterion I cared about -- which match entertained me the most? The Guns and Beer Money delivered in that regard.

[AlucardsFate]

*Just take my first jokey remark a wee bit too seriously...
All the title shots eh? I see that in another light. All the ways the front office forces him down our throats. Just because they put him in the main event over and over (And typically the SAME main event over and over) that isn't an accomplishment in my eyes. It's the beginnings of creative bankruptcy. And as good as the Nexus angle was in parts...and could have been in other parts. They completely screwed it up...by again forcing him down our throats. I can't recall the last time I've seen so much good build up ruined by their own shortsighted thinking. For me it's mostly been "business as usual in Cenaworld" Same formulaic spot monkey matches...same formulaic pandering little spirited speeches. As far as putting anyone over...the only one I can think of is Barrett. Wade Barrett has absolutely been sold as a legitimate competitor...the others...not so much.

As far as the other thing. That is more on Beer Money then anything. I can't say I've ever watched them and been impressed. MCMG could absolutely put on a MOTY caliber contest. I just don't believe they can saddled with BM. I'm basically just saying a damn miracle must have happened for that to have been anywhere near the HBK/Taker match, not to mention above it. Besides everyone is a little biased towards the things they like. (Anyone who denies it is lying to themselves) You see them through different goggles. I mean, is the Sharpshooter really the move of the year? Probably not, but the nostalgic thrill of my inner child seeing Bret Hart apply it one more time overrides all sense of reason...so yes.

Just my 3 cents. Because I always add one more. I'm the generous type.

[SnakeEyez]

*Just take my first jokey remark a wee bit too seriously...
...seriously, what are you going on about this time? You said something that warranted a response from me, so I responded to it. That's all. I fail to see how that constitutes "taking it too seriously." You said that all of Cena's matches are the same and I questioned how that was relevant when "Wrestler of the Year" should be determined by more than just match caliber. If that category was graded on wrestling ability alone, Miz wouldn't win it either; he's a good wrestler, but he's not the best out there. Implying that I'm "taking it too seriously" is nonsense.

All the title shots eh? I see that in another light. All the ways the front office forces him down our throats. Just because they put him in the main event over and over (And typically the SAME main event over and over) that isn't an accomplishment in my eyes. It's the beginnings of creative bankruptcy. And as good as the Nexus angle was in parts...and could have been in other parts. They completely screwed it up...by again forcing him down our throats. I can't recall the last time I've seen so much good build up ruined by their own shortsighted thinking. For me it's mostly been "business as usual in Cenaworld" Same formulaic spot monkey matches...same formulaic pandering little spirited speeches. As far as putting anyone over...the only one I can think of is Barrett. Wade Barrett has absolutely been sold as a legitimate competitor...the others...not so much.

As far as the other thing. That is more on Beer Money then anything. I can't say I've ever watched them and been impressed. MCMG could absolutely put on a MOTY caliber contest. I just don't believe they can saddled with BM. I'm basically just saying a damn miracle must have happened for that to have been anywhere near the HBK/Taker match, not to mention above it. Besides everyone is a little biased towards the things they like. (Anyone who denies it is lying to themselves) You see them through different goggles. I mean, is the Sharpshooter really the move of the year? Probably not, but the nostalgic thrill of my inner child seeing Bret Hart apply it one more time overrides all sense of reason...so yes.

I have already explained in great detail why I made these two choices. Any further defense of them is borderline redundant at this point, so I'll sum it up like so: John Cena is my Wrestler of the Year because he was an integral cornerstone of WWE programming for the whole year. The MCMG/Beer Money match was MOTY because it entertained me. The "damn miracle" that happened was that they had an entertaining match that I enjoyed. That's all there is to it. Nothing miraculous about that. Then again, considering some of the crap that both TNA and WWE shovel out on a weekly basis, maybe a good back-and-forth tag team match really is something of a miracle.

[AlucardsFate]

This first remark was a silly little joke and you went all out there over it...that's all.

[SnakeEyez]

So Alberto Del Rio won the Royal Rumble, huh? Interesting. I think it might be a little too soon to have him headline Wrestlemania, but a lot can happen between now and then. With the right booking, he might just make a believer out of me in the next two months.

[AlucardsFate]

So Alberto Del Rio won the Royal Rumble, huh? Interesting. I think it might be a little too soon to have him headline Wrestlemania, but a lot can happen between now and then. With the right booking, he might just make a believer out of me in the next two months.

Yeah...I was quite surprised watching that. BUT...with the final entrants I was left with...I figure he was the best option. (I will be DAMNED if I see another Cena main event. And Orton needs some new material...)

Seeing Kevin Nash in his old Diesel outfit was...interesting. He didn't look any better moving around, but it was the most entertaining he's been in a long time.

For the second year in a row, the best part about the Rumble was CM Punk's temporary dominance of it. He always makes it a great show when he's clearing the ring...over and over...and over.

[SnakeEyez]

Yeah...I was quite surprised watching that. BUT...with the final entrants I was left with...I figure he was the best option. (I will be DAMNED if I see another Cena main event. And Orton needs some new material...)

Well, we're probably going to see Miz vs. Cena at Wrestlemania anyway. Consider yourself damned.

So, following the events of the Royal Rumble, it looks like we might be heading toward these matches at 'Mania.
* Miz vs. John Cena
* Edge vs. Alberto Del Rio
* Randy Orton vs. CM Punk
* Rey Mysterio vs. Cody Rhodes

Rumor has it that we might also be seeing Undertaker vs. Wade Barrett and maybe Triple H vs. Sheamus, Part 2.

[Scion_of_Life]

I would like to see Triple H make his return to the ring. Undertaker too I guess. Seeing Wade Barrett getting planted by a Tombstone Piledriver would bring a smile to my face. Nothing would bring me greater joy than to see Barrett ended. Except maybe Vickie Guerrero being on the receiving end of a spear that she rightly deserves after firing Kelly Kelly last night. Predictably though, Teddy Long will show up in a week or so and correct her wrongs. I also wouldn't be surprised if Edge does lose the World Heavyweight Title next week either. Which sucks...a lot.

[AlucardsFate]

I would like to see Triple H make his return to the ring. Undertaker too I guess. Seeing Wade Barrett getting planted by a Tombstone Piledriver would bring a smile to my face. Nothing would bring me greater joy than to see Barrett ended. Except maybe Vickie Guerrero being on the receiving end of a spear that she rightly deserves after firing Kelly Kelly last night. Predictably though, Teddy Long will show up in a week or so and correct her wrongs. I also wouldn't be surprised if Edge does lose the World Heavyweight Title next week either. Which sucks...a lot.

I didn't watch...she fired Kelly?

GO VICKIE! (About time you make yourself a little more tolerable) About time that no talent hack of a lady wrestler disappeared. (hopefully for good) Hopefully that leaves room for ladies who can do more then smile and trip over their own feet.

I am in no hurry to see the return of Triple H. We are doing just fine without him. The last thing I need to see is Wade Barrett's young career destroyed by Triple H's ego. The only thing I know about Smackdown this week is that Booker T was added to the commentator team. I can see that working. WWE's problem with their commentators is they don't add anyone with a natural personality. (Usually just super straight stick men) If there is one thing Booker was good at, it was personality, he can do that nicely.

[Scion_of_Life]

On one hand, you might be right, but I am going to respectfully disagree. I like Kelly Kelly. Other than the fact that she is messing with one of my favorite wrestlers, Drew McIntyre, she isn't so bad. I can't really understand why the WWE hasn't done something about Vickie. For years, she has done nothing but screw over anyone who isn't her current beau. She isn't anything to look at (and her one-dimensional personality was old three years ago) and I hate to say it, but the WWE doesn't owe the Guerrero family anything anymore. And Ziggler? The guy's a moron. I can't see his career lasting much longer than the current story arc.

Long will come back (and unfire Kelly). Vickie will get shot down. Edge will still be champion and Alberto Del Rio will lose at Wrestlemania. At least, that's how I see it.

[AlucardsFate]

McIntyre...is...kinda dull as it is now. But he probably CAN be good. Doesn't really seem like they are using him...at all right now. As far as your Kelly Kelly goes...hopefully her removal will allow women of actual talent to be on TV. Like Beth Phoenix. (She woulda snapped Kelly like a toothpick...but I guess we don't have to worry about that now do we?)

Edge the what champion? We are all forgetting the only important topic of discussion! The REAL World Champion...THE MIZ.

Why is The Miz so awesome? Could mere un-awesome mortals such as us ever hope to comprehend awesomeness on such a level? I think we can't. Our heads would explode. But he will put an old man away in a few weeks...then onward to the big game to put away whomever he faces...(probably Cena.)

[Scion_of_Life]

Well, Alucards, your greatest wish has been granted! John Cena will main event yet another Wrestlemania. Yippee...

[SnakeEyez]

I prefer to look at the situation in a glass-half-full manner: Miz is going to strike down John Cena at Wrestlemania and score the biggest win of his career! And hey, Cena, at least you'll still have your delicious Fruity Pebbles to console you after the loss.

[AlucardsFate]

Someone tell me they saw the end of Raw. I was actually a little bit perplexed by this segment. I mean, The Rock can make anything instantly classic (And I will remember him calling John Cena a "Homeless Power Ranger" forever and ever) But they have The Rock come out there and get real angry and yell about Cena. Then Cena enters. Okay so far so good.

What does Cena do? Now that he FINALLY has The Rock face to face, what he's asked for, for a month? He...KISSES THE PEOPLE'S ASS!? Now I can't believe I'm about to say this...as I am the most anti-Cena person in the history of...ever. But I think it kinda sells Cena short doesn't it? A bad thing especially going into Sunday. It was pretty much someone begging for a fight until the fight is actually going to happen, then talking about how sensible an individual he is.

I mean, despite my best wishes and positive thinking it's still looking like The Miz isn't coming out of WM title intact. (Though my inner self still hopes for a Miz victory) But it just kind of destroys Cena's momentum doesn't it?

Also, just when I thought that the WWE couldn't ruin Kane anymore then they already have...they somehow find a way to prove me wrong. EVERY TIME. If you saw it, you know of what I speak. Just...no.

[SnakeEyez]

Well, Wrestlemania is tonight, so let's hear some predictions.

Jerry "The King" Lawler vs. Michael Cole
This is by far the easiest match to predict. Cole has no chance in hell. The fans have been waiting months -- years, even -- to see somebody beat the hell out of Michael Cole. Our wishes are finally going to come true.
Winner: Jerry "The King" Lawler

John Morrison, Trish Stratus, and Snooki vs. Dolph Ziggler and Laycool
Ugh. Why is this match even happening? I honestly don't care one way or another, but I'm pretty sure the good guys are going to win because Snooki is on the team and the celebrity guest rarely (never?) loses at Wrestlemania.
Winners: John Morrison, Trish Stratus, and Snooki

Randy Orton vs. CM Punk
This one could really go either way, I think. Orton has been made to look really strong these past few weeks with him taking out all the Nexus guys, but then Punk rebounded and busted up his leg. It's a tough call, but I think I have to go with Punk. He needs the win more than Orton does. Besides which, I can't be the only one who thinks Orton is starting to get a little stale.
Winner: CM Punk

Big Show, Kane, Santino Marella, and Kofi Kingston vs. The Corre
Firstly, I must express my disappointment that they took Koslov out of the match. Don't get me wrong, I love Kofi Kingston (I honestly think he's ready to be a main-eventer right now), but he's already had plenty of Wrestlemania moments. If I'm not mistaken, this was going to be Vlad's first Wrestlemania appearance (not counting pre-show battle royals and whatnot), so it sucks that that was taken away from him at the last minute. But anyway, enough of that. I see The Corre dominating Smackdown for a while, so a win here could really solidify them as a threat that should be taken seriously. I say The Corre wins after poor Santino gets Book of Ezekiel'd out of his bright blue boots.
Winners: The Corre

Sheamus vs. Daniel Bryan
You know what this match should have been? Sheamus vs. Daniel Bryan vs. Dolph Ziggler vs. John Morrison in a fatal four-way. Then the mixed tag match could have just been a regular two-on-two tag match between the ladies. Yeah, that would have been awesome. As it stands, though, I'm going to say that Sheamus gets the win and retains the title. I expect these two to have a tremendous match, though.
Winner: Sheamus

Rey Mysterio vs. Cody Rhodes
I am really enjoying Cody's new darker character, but Rey Mysterio just never freaking loses.
Winner: Rey Mysterio

Edge vs. Alberto Del Rio
I'm calling it right now: Christian turns on Edge and costs him the World Heavyweight Title. I've been smelling a swerve like this for weeks.
Winner: Alberto Del Rio

The Undertaker vs. Triple H
Oh yes, this one is going to be great. Despite everything we hear about the guy's ego, surely even Triple H realizes that The Streak is sacred. I think he knows better than to break it, especially since it seems like Triple H's career may be winding down soon and winning this match won't do a whole lot for him in the long run.
Winner: The Undertaker

The Miz vs. John Cena
Now this one...this one is really tough to call. When this whole war of the words between Cena and Rock first began, I suspected that Rock was going to get involved in this match to screw over Cena, allowing Miz to steal the victory and retain the title. This would set up an extended post-Wrestlemania feud between Rock and Cena while Miz could go off and do his own thing for a while longer. However, the latest reports making the rounds is that this match will be the final match of the Pay-Per-View. If this match is going to close out the show, then the good guy has to win, right? I mean, has there ever been a Wrestlemania where a heel has won the final match of the night? The people have to go home happy, after all, so the good guy has to prevail. Argh, this is a tough one to call. My brain says to go with Cena but my heart says to go with Miz. I have to make a prediction, though, so I will...I will side with my brain and pick Cena. I hope Miz wins, though, because The Miz is awesome.
Winner: John Cena

[Ed209]

I can't wait for Hulk Hogan vs. King Kong Bundy in the steel cage. Wait? Whats that? That was Wrestlemania 2? Oh.

I dunno who have these guys are. I just hope Snooki gets accidentaly punched in the face. HARD.

[AlucardsFate]

Ya know that they want $55 to order it? I don't think I want to pay that. Especially considering the card, I think I'll see um *ahem* "somehow" and skip Raw. So don't tell me what happens.

Jerry "The King" Lawler vs. Michael Cole
Yeah I don't foresee any surprises here. I'm going to have to agree with Brian.
Winner: Jerry "The King" Lawler

John Morrison, Trish Stratus, and Snooki vs. Dolph Ziggler and Laycool
Ditto here. The celebrity doesn't lose. (At least it will allow Morrison to win a match!)
Winners: John Morrison, Trish Stratus, and Snooki

Randy Orton vs. CM Punk
I want Punk to win. I love Punk. I don't care about Orton that much. (Yeah he needs to freshen himself up) But my heart of hearts feels like they are going for the "Placate the masses" approach and we are going to see Orton win then never speak of this feud again.
Winner: Orton

Big Show, Kane, Santino Marella, and Kofi Kingston vs. The Corre
Kofi ready for the main event....I don't think he has the personality chops for that. (Or A personality even) But anyway, I could honestly give two shits about what happens in this match after what they did to Kane on Raw. (The front office's 234th slight against Kane) But I think they really do need to sell The Corre. (god that name is stupid) They aren't anywhere near a legitimate, well a legitimate anything! They survive on Wade Barrett's left over mic skills.
Winners: The Corre

Sheamus vs. Daniel Bryan
Ya know, Daniel Bryan had a ready made fan base coming in...and they squandered it. He needs this win. But since Sheamus just won the title, I don't see him losing it. Which is fine too, because I am a fan of Sheamus.
Winner: Sheamus

Rey Mysterio vs. Cody Rhodes
NO! Against my better judgement, I wanna say Cody. I've been Cody's #1 supporter since he was in legacy. I dunno if his new character is darker...I find it more cartoony that he's covering his face when their is nothing wrong with him. He's got that Victor Von Doom complex. So I'm going to take a chance here and bet against Rey. Because I like The Dashing one.
Winner: Cody Rhodes

Edge vs. Alberto Del Rio
I was going to go with a simple Edge wins blah blah...but Brian presents an interesting theory. And Christian...if anyone NEEDS something to push him forward. Something so they don't have an excuse to hold him down for another year. So I'll give your gamble some thought.
Winner: Alberto Del Rio

The Undertaker vs. Triple H
I don't see them letting The Streak go. It's too marketable. I do expect a good match...but it seems like it has no ramifications whatsoever. I don't see Triple H leaving if he fails. Either way Taker has this.
Winner: The Undertaker

The Miz vs. John Cena
I hope Cena falls ill and cannot wrestle. (If what he does can actually be called such) But in all likelyhood Cena isn't going to lose, that's just the way things are. (And the way they have been set up) The Miz has been getting the better of him too much going in. So Cena will come out on top. But:
Winner: Nobody...because Cena is the champion[/QUOTE]

[SnakeEyez]

Looks like I went 3-5 in predictions. God, I suck. But hey, at least The Miz won, so I'm glad that I got that one wrong.

Note: This isn't including the Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus match (which didn't happen) and I'm not acknowledging that retarded reversed decision in the Lawler-Cole match.

[Chuypc]

Heh, I never thought I replied anything to this thread at all, but today I went with my bro and his friends to a bar to see Wrestlemania. It was fun! Too bad the 2 mexicans (well, one is from San Diego) lost their matches. But that Capt. Mysterio costume... it was sooo bad :p.

The best fight was easily the Undertaker vs Triple H. Holy shit! he didn't stayed down.

And Snooki surprised and scared the shit out of me with those flips...

And I was wondering why everyone in the bar was boooing John Cena, I thought he was popular!

[SnakeEyez]

And I was wondering why everyone in the bar was boooing John Cena, I thought he was popular!

Women and children love Cena. Men hate him.

I...I don't know why. That's just the way things are.

[Heiae]

Women and children love Cena. Men hate him.

I...I don't know why. That's just the way things are.

Because he dresses like he lives in a Wal-Mart parking lot.

Remember when the big names had style?

I don't even watch Wrestling regularly and every time I see him I get nothing from his persona.

[RedWizard]

Tangentially relevant information:

Remember the crying wrestling fan video? Well, the other day on Tosh.0, Daniel Tosh gave said fan the Web Redemption treatment, and retired superstars Koko B Ware and Ted DiBiase both showed up for some wrasslin and laughs. Also, Tosh dressed up as the Ultimate Warrior, and did a pretty decent impression.

[Source]

Bored and want to go ahead and get thoughts out of head...

The Good:

Orton/Punk- Great selling of the leg by Orton and Punk being smart as to not fall for Orton playing possum to hit the RKO only to springboard into it was really good.

HHH/Taker- Not a major good because they're getting awfully close to Kurt Angle territory with the finisher-fest Taker WM matches with the last three. Taker's selling at the end was amazing in an "old bastard who knows he's over-the-hill and should just stay down, but guts it out anyways to pull out a win".

Edge/ADR- Not much of one, but it twas a decent match. Expected a bit better out of Alberto, though. However, Edge still sucks ass. That'll always be an eternal truth.

Rhodes/Mysterio- The idea.

Snooki- Yeah, I know, but I have to give her props for the handspring. Didn't see it coming at ALL.

8-Man Tag- Only for Slater's glorious sell of the Cobra/KO Punch combo. Especially the fucking slo-mo replay which just added to the awesomeness.

Cena and Miz's pre-match video packages and entrances(sans the "AWESOME" balloons. Those were just crappy)- Just beautiful. Great song selections. The WWE's production team did a GREAT job.


The Bad:

Rock's opening promo- Nothing to say and he didn't even bother dressing up to give the illusion that he might not do anything physical. Fuck that noise.

The crowd- Either they just didn't give a shit or they were mic'd horribly a la WM 24.

Rhodes/Mysterio- The execution. UG-LY. Rey was pretty damn bad.

The mixed tag as a whole- Kinda lost track on WTF was going on. Have to re-watch.

The backstage skits- Ugh, ugh, UGH. No more Snoop Dogg, please.

Cole/Lawler- It was like Bret/Vince from last year all over again. I'll admit I laughed my ass off that Lawler didn't get his precious WM win, but I wish I had that 10 minutes of my life back again. Really did nothing for anybody involved(and made both Lawler and Austin look like huge dicks for attacking Matthews like that. Booker getting all excited and jumping into the ring was.. weird). WM's not the place for Dusty finishes like that and given the location and the history of the company that ran there, the bookers should've known better.

Cena/Miz- The whole first half of the match seemed to be moving in super slo-mo and then picked up a really good pace and was finally starting to get the crowd into and then BAM! Double fucking count-out at motherfucking WRESTLEMANIA in the motherfucking MAIN EVENT. Whoever booked this should've been fired YESTERDAY. And then Rocky comes out and re-starts the match but the damage has already been done and the crowd was pretty much lost. It does nothing for Miz or Cena especially when Rock goes and beats up Miz again, anyway. If they did this just to build to Rock/Cena at WM next year, then some fucking heads need to roll.

[AlucardsFate]

Finally watched it. (had to wait for my watching partners...we always watch it together)

Jerry "The King" Lawler vs. Michael Cole
Well it was about what I could expect. Not really terribly entertaining, but whatever. At least Cole had a little blood on his teeth.

John Morrison, Trish Stratus, and Snooki vs. Dolph Ziggler and Laycool
Gah....whatever about this match. Trish wrestled the whole thing. BUT I can say this, Snooki...surprisingly enough has done more then most of the guest celebrities do. She actually executed a move. Like...did something. (That cartwheel back flip ass bump thing Chyna used to do) But otherwise...meh whatever.

Randy Orton vs. CM Punk
Well Orton really needed to bring it here. But he relied on stale old Orton tricks. His same few moves again. Despite CM Punk...being his awesome self and doing some neat stuff.

Big Show, Kane, Santino Marella, and Kofi Kingston vs. The Corre
Wow...Just ruin Kane some more. And The Corre needed the win here. They need to be sold as a real threat. They screwed the pooch here.

Rey Mysterio vs. Cody Rhodes
I can't believe I got this right. I'm all about Cody winning though. Go Dashing one go! The match was pretty good too all things considered. I loved Cody's entrance with all the newspaper headlines with his picture "HIDEOUS!" "DISFIGURED!" Etc. Cody took a very stupid character idea made it good...now he's making it great. I love the way he's playing this all "Phantom of the Opera." What's even better is I've been a supporter of his almost since his arrival. (Since he turned on Hardcore Holly anyway...he cut a nasty good promo right after that and I've been watching him since) I don't get a lot of "I toldjaso" moments. Go Dashing one go?

Edge vs. Alberto Del Rio
Decent match, not GREAT mind you, but decent enough. Nothing else to say.

The Undertaker vs. Triple H
I'm torn here. The match itself was great. Not HBK/Taker great...not close. BUT it was great. What happened AFTER the match where Undertaker had to be carried out while the loser walked out. That bugged me. If Taker is actually hurt then I can let that go...if not...that sells him REALLY SHORT. Makes him look bad and I will be quite upset.

The Miz vs. John Cena
WTF happened here? Wait I know...

JOHN CENA SUCKS ASS.

God bless Miz for trying as hard as he was, but Cena displayed all of his flaws in a single match here. (A new record low)

He's a klutz. While running the ropes he was supposed to hop over Miz. A standard maneuver. HE TRIPPED ON HIM AND FELL ON HIS FACE. I am not kidding. (Props to Good Ol JR for trying to save face there by explaining that maybe Cena got wanged on the head or something)

He knows exactly 3 moves. Cena's match formula is to get murdered till the end where he does these three moves. Now this punching bag formula isn't necessarily bad, but Cena has another issue that makes this impossible for him to pull off effectively.

He can't sell worth a damn. He either doesn't sell at all...ever or he sells WAY TO HARD. His only settings are INVINCIBLE and I'M DYING. You can get your ass kicked and still be entertaining if you can sell it. An example? Jeff Hardy...when he isn't drunk/doped up/both can sell like a bastard. Even getting destroyed he is still fun to watch.

As a result...this match was...despite Miz's best efforts...just bad. Not fitting of WM at all. The Rock tried to salvage it in the end...and at least The Miz won. We still have a real champion. Don't worry Miz, I still think you're awesome. And you...unlike Cena actually DID get your head wanged really hard. (I wouldn't doubt he has a concussion right now)

Final Grade: C

Screencapped these from the Cody Rhodes match. This is the reason I think Cody should wear kneepads:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/G-Prime/vlcsnap-2011-04-11-19h36m44s178.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/G-Prime/vlcsnap-2011-04-11-19h40m14s249.png
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/G-Prime/vlcsnap-2011-04-11-19h41m04s229.png

[Scion_of_Life]

Okay, so am I the only one who thinks that "Kharma" is too fat to compete in the Diva's division. There are (or at least were) weight classes for a reason. She has to outweigh even Beth Phoenix by 100 pounds. Jeez...

[AlucardsFate]

I'm actually happy to see Awesome Kharma. They needs a monster. She is gonna add a much needed shot of variety to the crapfest known as the Diva's division.

[SnakeEyez]

Okay, so am I the only one who thinks that "Kharma" is too fat to compete in the Diva's division. There are (or at least were) weight classes for a reason. She has to outweigh even Beth Phoenix by 100 pounds. Jeez...

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that you've never actually seen Awesome Kong wrestle. She may be big, but she's not clumsy or careless or anything. She knows what she's doing in the ring.

[Scion_of_Life]

I'm actually happy to see Awesome Kharma. They needs a monster. She is gonna add a much needed shot of variety to the crapfest known as the Diva's division.

I agree with you that the Diva division needs to be shaken up, but I'm not sure that this is the way to do it. Though if they are gonna have a fat giant in the Diva division, then they might want to make it somewhat competitive and have Kharma go after Beth Phoenix.

[AlucardsFate]

I agree with you that the Diva division needs to be shaken up, but I'm not sure that this is the way to do it. Though if they are gonna have a fat giant in the Diva division, then they might want to make it somewhat competitive and have Kharma go after Beth Phoenix.

But that's the point! She smashes the Barbies....it's what Kong is all about.

[Scion_of_Life]

But that's the point! She smashes the Barbies....it's what Kong is all about.

Well, Gail Kim managed to beat her on TNA. So Kong, I mean Kharma, can beat anyone who doesn't have talent. That would explain why she attacked an already down Maryse and left Kelly Kelly alone. Cause Kelly would find a way to beat her!

[AlucardsFate]

Well, Gail Kim managed to beat her on TNA. So Kong, I mean Kharma, can beat anyone who doesn't have talent. That would explain why she attacked an already down Maryse and left Kelly Kelly alone. Cause Kelly would find a way to beat her!

...But...Kelly sucks. Like...a lot. Maryse at least can work a mic (If only in French)

[Scion_of_Life]

...But...Kelly sucks. Like...a lot. Maryse at least can work a mic (If only in French)

Yeah, I know that Kelly isn't the greatest, but I like her...spunk. Yeah, that's it. Spunk.

[AlucardsFate]

Brian, watch Raw. Watch the end of it rather.

THAT WAS THE SHIT.

EASILY the best thing I've seen on a WWE program since...
...um...FUCK SINCE 2000.

[SnakeEyez]

What, Cena going through a table? That wasn't anything special.

EDIT: Oh, I see now. I had just watched the videos on wwe.com, which made no mention of the post-match promo from Punk. Very interesting. I love it when a wrestling organization does something that makes me think, "Is this real or scripted? I really can't tell." Hats off to you, Mr. Punk.

[Scion_of_Life]

So John Cena was ready to walk out last night before Mr. McMahon reinstated CM Punk. However, if Cena loses to Punk at Money in the Bank, then Cena is fired for "embarrassing" McMahon.

[AlucardsFate]

God I want Punk to win. (Though he won't) Punk winning the title..."Leaving" and Cena getting fired all in one day? That would be moment of this millennium. Nothing would please me more.

[Scion_of_Life]

God I want Punk to win. (Though he won't) Punk winning the title..."Leaving" and Cena getting fired all in one day? That would be moment of this millennium. Nothing would please me more.

I never thought I would say this, but I definitely agree with you.

[AlucardsFate]

Sweet Jesus Christ on a bicycle, Christian wins...then CM Punk wins right after? Could that have been any better of a night?

Even Cena put on a half decent match, coupled with Punk's awesome (And the crowd's rowdiness) made for a pretty damn spectacular affair. I haven't seen a crowd like that since like 2000....

[Scion_of_Life]

Sweet Jesus Christ on a bicycle, Christian wins...then CM Punk wins right after? Could that have been any better of a night?

Even Cena put on a half decent match, coupled with Punk's awesome (And the crowd's rowdiness) made for a pretty damn spectacular affair. I haven't seen a crowd like that since like 2000....

I rather enjoyed the show too. I was hoping Christian would win and he did! I wasn't sure on the Cena/Punk matchup. Mainly because I didn't care.

[AlucardsFate]

Well I do have to amend my statement, Hogan vs The Rock at Wrestlemania had a crowd this crazy. So there was that. But they were SO into it it was insane.

But how could you not care about that match? As one of CM Punk's supporters (Before just recently) I was happy to see it, especially because he's been on fire. And the finish was dynamite. Just wish that The Miz had won, he got close!

[SnakeEyez]

Allow me to indulge in a bit of backseat booking for a moment. Now I haven't seen last night's show yet, but I was following the live results on Wrestleview and I've read the full recap. Sounds like it was a good show, but if I was in charge (which I'm not, but don't take this moment away from me, darn it), here's what I would have done differently.

First off, the order of the matches was perfect, so no changes are needed there. While I'm really glad that Daniel Bryan won the Smackdown MitB briefcase, I'd have given it to Cody Rhodes instead. The guy has been terrific on Smackdown and I think he's ready to be the World Champion.

Sometime between this match and the Orton-Christian match, have Josh Matthews or whoever interview Rhodes backstage about his win. Rhodes would say that unlike all the past winners of the MitB briefcase, he's not going to attack the champion in a moment of weakness like a coward -- because Cody Rhodes is no coward. He's going to make it clear when he intends on cashing in. Whoever wins the Orton-Christian match is going to have to defend that title against Cody Rhodes next month at Summerslam. The showdown is set.

Alberto Del Rio still wins the Raw MitB match. No change needed there.

Fast forward to the main event. None of that Vince McMahon run-in malarkey at the end. Just have CM Punk beat Cena clean with the GTS to win the title. As Punk is celebrating with the Chicago crowd, Alberto Del Rio's music hits and he makes his way to the ring alongside Vince McMahon. Punk acts like he knew this was coming and prepares for battle. McMahon and Cena stay at ringside while Del Rio and Punk wrestle.

This scenario has been rumored for weeks, so everyone in the crowd kinds of expects it. They're expecting Del Rio to win this match and become the new champion. Now imagine their surprise when an exhausted CM Punk manages to lock in the Anaconda Vice and make Del Rio tap out. The fans would go apeshit. Punk beats Cena and Del Rio in the same night? Kick-ass! They never thought that would happen. They'd be cheering their heads off.

As McMahon is screaming at Del Rio and Cena at ringside and Punk is laughing at them from the ring...Cody Rhodes' music hits and he struts out to the ring with the other briefcase. Everyone looks surprised. McMahon had a backup plan (Alberto Del Rio) but that was it. He's just as surprised as everybody else.

Punk is pissed now, shouting "Are you fucking kidding me?" from the ring as Cody get in and the match starts. They wrestle and Cody Rhodes is firmly in control since Punk is beyond exhausted right now. Eventually Punk makes a comeback, there are some false finishes at the end, and Punk finally manages to get Rhodes up on his shoulders for the GTS. He connects with the move, but then he immediately clutches his knee and screams in pain. Cody sits up, undamaged, and taps his face mask with a smile. That crafty bastard. Then he hits Punk with the Cross Rhodes and gets the pin.

In one fell swoop, Cody Rhodes becomes the most hated man in the WWE. McMahon gets in the ring to celebrate with him while Del Rio and Cena head to the back, dejected. After the cameras stop rolling, Punk can get on the microphone and say his goodbyes to the Chicago crowd so that they'll be able to go home happy.

This scenario works out for everybody. For starters, Rhodes' misleading backstage promo where he claims that he'll cash in the briefcase at Summerslam adds some extra surprise to the Orton-Christian match. Everyone in the audience will be thinking, "Well, Rhodes is a heel and he's challenging for the title, so that means Orton is going to win the match tonight. If Christian wins and he defends against Rhodes, that will be heel vs. heel and we can't have that." This will make it all the more surprising when Christian does beat Orton for the title. Everyone will be expecting Rhodes to challenge for the Smackdown title. They will probably have forgotten that the briefcase holder can challenge for either world title.

It benefits Rhodes tremendously since it makes him look like even more of a chickenshit heel (saying he won't cash in the briefcase like a coward just so he can then cash in the briefcase like a coward later in the night). Like I said earlier, I think he's ready for a reign as WWE Champion. This is his time to shine, and I'm sure he can carry Raw for at least a couple months. He can feud with Cena, Mysterio, Big Show, or maybe even Alex Riley if they continue to build him up like they've been doing for the past few weeks.

It benefits Del Rio and Cena as well. After the PPV, McMahon can start a program with them were he's angry that they let him down and failed to get the job done. He can make their lives a living hell by stacking the odds against them at every opportunity. It doesn't hurt Cena too much since he lost to Punk after a long and grueling match and it shouldn't hurt Del Rio too much since he was beaten by the Anaconda Vice, a move that Punk hasn't used in months (so obviously Del Rio wasn't expecting it and wasn't prepared for it). It would also help to light a fire under Del Rio since he's earned the dubious distinction of being the only MitB winner so far who failed to win the title when he cashed in. That would make him angry and give him one more thing to whine about. Or maybe you could go another route, turn Del Rio face (having him feud with McMahon would be a great way to do that), and then have him go after Cody Rhodes for showing him up and making him look bad. It's a possibility.

Most of all, it benefits CM Punk because it took not one, not two, but three wrestlers to take him down. That makes him look like a total badass. He goes out in a blaze of glory in his hometown and his post-match promo lets the fans go home on a high note.

Granted, I'm sure the WWE has their own plan for the storyline going forward, and who knows -- maybe it's better than the one I just described. Maybe Punk isn't really leaving aft all. Maybe this entire thing is just an elaborate storyline and they've fooled us all. We'll have to wait and see. I think my scenario is pretty good, if I do say so myself. The WWE Title stays in the company, Punk looks awesome to the very end, several new programs are set up, and Rhodes gets elevated to that main event level. Sure, there are a few disadvantages (for example, we don't get to watch the MitB briefcase holders for weeks and weeks as we anticipate the moment when they cash in), but they're minor.

I put way too much thought into this.

[AlucardsFate]

Oh lordy...this is getting even better. (Even if Cena is still here)

Proof that when they REALLY try...WWE can still turn it up to 11. They are unmatched on the creative end, when they want to be.

I was actually going to try to watch Impact again just because I was told of something that occured last week (Actually several things) that were so mind numbingly stupid just hearing them that I simply had to confirm their existence, but I don't know if I can subject myself to such garbage right now...not right now.

[Scion_of_Life]

But how could you not care about that match? As one of CM Punk's supporters (Before just recently) I was happy to see it, especially because he's been on fire. And the finish was dynamite. Just wish that The Miz had won, he got close!

I don't really like Cena or Punk. If I had to pick one to support, I would choose Punk, if only because the guy is interesting. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Punk comes back to the WWE (assuming the guy is really gone). Then, there could be some drama as to whom is the actual champion: the guy who took the title (after earning it) or the guy who won the tournament that McMahon designed (here's hoping Mysterio wins!).

Whatever though. I'm more interested in the upcoming match between Kane and Randy Orton on Smackdown Friday. The street fight should be pretty brutal.

On a more positive note though, RAW actually had matches going on all night tonight. Seven of them to be exact. What's the usual count? Three? Four? An improvement me thinks.

[AlucardsFate]

Orton/Kane is your focus?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v180/G-Prime/tumblr_llavvrkvLE1qbu7b1o1_500.gif
I mean I like Kane, I have for a long time but they just use him to job. And Orton puts on the same damn match every single time he goes out there. I hate him because I know he is better then that and he just...doesn't do it.

CM Punk has almost single handedly put me and the rest of us old warhorse fans back on the edge of our seats...a part of our seats that haven't seen use since 2000. And I already firmly believe that as it stands now, this whole storyline is a kind of Watershed moment in modern wrestling history. WWE has been running around unopposed for a decade now (With VERY mixed results) and TNA fired a shot at them...they didn't care, and rightfully so since I think they realize that TNA is so screwed up right now that they are no real threat. But Ring Of Honor just got the financial backing they needed to become a serious threat in the future. (They already had a stupid amount of talent under their umbrella and an experience wrestling mind in Jim Cornette...just no money) Basically this is Vince strutting his stuff "We still got it, so don't try it" etc. Frankly I can't remember the last time I was so amped to see next week.

Now were I to discuss a bizarre "What if" place for this to go?

So this Mon for all intents and story purposes, Vince McMahon has been ousted by the WWE Board of Directors, with the support of the McMahon family, including Triple H who has finally been publicly acknowledge as a McMahon. (They are really throwing all the cards down on the table right now, they even acknowledged TNA's existence) So...What does Vinny Mac do now? He disappears for awhile and the WWE soldiers on.

You may recall that recently that the "Sinclair Brodcasting Group" purchased Ring of Honor Wrestling. Who is Sinclair Brodcasting? Fuck if I know, I've never heard of them. So what if...theoretically in some fun story way...Vince McMahon owned a good deal of stock in that group? Wouldn't they put his experienced mind at the helm to guide RoH in the right direction? And his devious mind would look for a way to mobilize RoH to take his baby the WWE back by force. (With CM Punk at the forefront of this with the REAL WWE Championship in hand? Now that Vince has learned his lesson) INVASION 2!

Now this of course would require a backdoor partnership in the real world between Vince and RoH...which I don't see happening. (Mostly because Jim Cornette has a particular distaste for Vince McMahon) But wouldn't this be something if it happened!? This would likely fuck TNA over royally. With the state of affairs down in Orlando, having two direct VERY competent competitors would be their nail in the coffin.

Then ideally this all ends with Vince getting WWE back and then the WWE could do the dual brand thing...for real with RoH as a seperate entity with the same bankroll, so the multibrand thing doesn't seem so phony. (Like the Raw/Smackdown thing)

...the chances of this are somewhere in the range of .5-1% but I can dream right? (and if this actually by some miracle occurs...I can dish out "toldjasos")

[Scion_of_Life]

I just want to watch the match this Friday is all. I might even have to watch TNA this week. I hadn't realized how much former WWE "talent" they had picked up. That's where Jeff Hardy went...

Ring of Honor wrestling huh? I might have to google them.

[UmberHulk]

Cena needs a heel turn, badly.

[Scion_of_Life]

Cena needs a heel turn, badly.

Well, he might as well have been one in Chicago!

Also, the man needs an updated entrance theme and a fresh move set. Just sayin'.

[UmberHulk]

More like, he needs to have more than three moves.

[AlucardsFate]

More like, he needs to have more than three moves.

Yeah, I'll give him credit though. He didn't too to bad on Sun. (for him) Cena is this generations Hogan though. He's not a great wrestler by any stretch but he can work the mic and the kids love him like a superhero. Hogan was exactly the same in his day. But Cena does just wait for his 3 big moves and then calls it a day usually. Orton does that same shit...it's annoying.

[UmberHulk]

I like Orton. And atleast his moves look better. Cena's STF is the dumbest thing ever.

[SnakeEyez]

I like how they renamed Cena's "FU" to "Attitude Adjustment" and the "STFU" to "STF" to coincide with the new PG rating, but they felt that "Five-Knuckle Shuffle" was okay.

On an unrelated note, I have to waggle my finger disapprovingly at wwe.com for not caring enough to keep their NXT page updated. Yeah, I know, it's just NXT, but I still watch it every week. There are three guys left -- Titus O'Neil, Darren Young, and Derrick Bateman -- and voting opens this week to see who will be eliminated next. Who's listed on the poll? Titus O'Neil, Darren Young...and Conor O'Brien, who was eliminated weeks ago. How the heck and I supposed to vote for Bateman if he isn't even on the poll? Someone at wwe.com needs a slap on the wrist for that.

[AlucardsFate]

I like Orton. And atleast his moves look better. Cena's STF is the dumbest thing ever.

The STF is a legitimate submission though. Cena just applies it wrong. William Regal has a really good somewhat altered STF he calls "The Regal Stretch." That guy knows how to apply a submission. (WWE could have used him better, Regal is actually a very good wrestler he's just old)

[SnakeEyez]

Guess who just crashed the WWE/Mattel panel at Comic-Con.

2NAvDqglbAE

This has got to rank right up there as one of the best ideas the WWE has ever had. I seriously have no idea what's going to happen next in the ongoing CM Punk saga. Not a clue. I love it.

[AlucardsFate]

That man is a god.

[UmberHulk]

The STF is a legitimate submission though. Cena just applies it wrong. William Regal has a really good somewhat altered STF he calls "The Regal Stretch." That guy knows how to apply a submission. (WWE could have used him better, Regal is actually a very good wrestler he's just old)

I know. I just hate Cena's, especially when people tap out after four seconds.

[Scion_of_Life]

That man is a god.

Triple H? Why yes he is.

[AlucardsFate]

I was actually hoping for Punk to be gone for awhile, get back to normalcy then BAM there he is. But as it stands it was still a pretty epic moment. Though I feel bad for Rey...he got Christianed and he deserves better.

Though Punk entering to "Cult of Personality" (Which I was actually just listening to out of a random urge last week) Was not only totally fitting, but it was also:


BAD-ASS.

[Scion_of_Life]

I was actually hoping for Punk to be gone for awhile, get back to normalcy then BAM there he is. But as it stands it was still a pretty epic moment. Though I feel bad for Rey...he got Christianed and he deserves better.

Though Punk entering to "Cult of Personality" (Which I was actually just listening to out of a random urge last week) Was not only totally fitting, but it was also:


BAD-ASS.

I totally agree here. I didn't see Punk coming back tonight and I was genuinely happy when Rey won the title. Thankfully, all champions have their rematch clause, so Rey can challenge for the title again. I see a triple threat match at Summer Slam (Cena vs. Mysterio vs. Punk).

Also, seeing JR come back and Cole dressed as Triple H was pretty entertaining.

[SnakeEyez]

I just listened to a great interview with CM Punk where he talks about the current storyline.

Click Here (http://cdn16.castfire.com/audio/303/2117/7141/677919/simmons_2011-07-27-122419-3953-0-0-0.32.mp3?cdn_id=33&uuid=c9b71dce471721bd1dae5dc135c3295f&referer=http%3A%2F%2Fespnradio.espn.go.com%2Fespnr adio%2FclipArchive%3FshowID%3Dbsreport)

It's about an hour long, so if you don't want to listen to the whole thing, here are some highlights.
* There is no long-term plan for the current CM Punk saga. They are just making it up as they go along.
* During Punk's initial shoot promo on Raw a couple weeks ago, he was given full freedom to say whatever he wanted. All they told him beforehand was that they were going to cut the microphone once they felt that he had said enough.
* On that same night, in the time that it took Punk to get from the stage to the backstage area (a span of about 8 minutes), he had gotten over 200 calls and text messages.
* Punk's contract really was expiring on the day of the Money in the Bank PPV and he was legitimately leaving the company. He didn't re-sign with the WWE until a few days after the PPV, so even through his match with Cena, he had every intention of just walking away. He didn't say how long he'll be sticking around.
* What made him change his mind? He wanted to leave because he was exhausted, burned out, and frustrated, but the past few weeks have lit a new fire under him and he doesn't feel tired anymore. He feels reinvigorated and wants to capitalize on the buzz.
* He hasn't watched his Money in the Bank match with Cena yet. He rarely watches any of his old matches because he's a perfectionist and he spends too much time noticing the things he could have done better.
* Punk says that Cena catches a lot of crap from the fans for being a bad wrestler, but he's actually one of Punk's favorite people to work with in the ring.
* Aside from himself, who does Punk think is the best wrestler in the WWE today? Rey Mysterio.
* Who helped Punk the most when he first came to the WWE? Eddie Guerrero.
* Up-and-coming stars that Punk says you should keep an eye on: The Miz, Evan Bourne, Kofi Kingston, and Dolph Ziggler.
* His new music, "Cult of Personality," is actually an old theme that he used in his Ring of Honor days.

[AlucardsFate]

Well I didn't know he had used it before, I just knew it was an old song by Living Colour. Kinda makes me feel old...

[SnakeEyez]

So let me get this straight. This epic showdown between John Cena and CM Punk -- which had the potential to be one of the most anticipated wrestling matches in history -- ends with a screwy finish (namely, Cena's foot being on the bottom rope as the pinfall was counted) that damages Punk's credibility and further reinforces the idea that Cena never loses clean. Then, completely out of nowhere...Kevin freaking Nash gets involved for no apparent reason and beats up CM Punk even though he's a living fossil with only one good leg? And the entire Undisputed Championship showdown ended up being moot because Alberto Del Rio walks away with the championship at the end?

Did...did TNA book this match? TNA booked this match, didn't they?

[UmberHulk]

Del Rio was scheduled to win before this whole Punk thing exploded; they want him to be champion when they go on their Mexico tour. Possibly with a title match between him and Rey.

Kevin Nash was because they needed to have Punk damaged I guess. And Nash makes sense, because since he knows HHH, it builds mistrust between Punk and HHH.

I'm cool with it, because Del Rio is awesome.

[SnakeEyez]

Del Rio was scheduled to win before this whole Punk thing exploded
Where did you hear this?

Kevin Nash was because they needed to have Punk damaged I guess. And Nash makes sense, because since he knows HHH, it builds mistrust between Punk and HHH.
I...guess that makes sense. I just have a really tough time viewing Kevin Nash as a threat at this point, though. He's old and decrepit, and he's had so many knee and ankle surgeries over the years that he's about as mobile as Khali at this point. Besides which, when you look at the youth movement going on in the WWE at the moment, it seems kind of odd to bring back a relic from the past like Nash.

Furthermore, following the events of last night, it looks like we might be heading toward a Kevin Nash vs. CM Punk feud, which just sounds horrible to me. That is going to put a serious damper on Punk's momentum.

I'm cool with it, because Del Rio is awesome.
Don't get me wrong -- I like Del Rio too. This just doesn't seem like a good time for him to be champion. Punk is red-hot right now. There's no question that he is the hottest commodity in wrestling at this point in time. It makes sense to put the championship on the star of your show, right? CM Punk is the star right now, not Del Rio.

I'm trying to keep my feelings in check and just see where they go with this, but I'm just...very, very confused right now. And not in a "I can't wait to see what happens next" kind of way either. It's more of a "What on Earth are they thinking?" kind of confused.

[UmberHulk]

Basically a guy in another forum who follows the insider stuff told me, and that may seem sketchy, but they were saying this before the cm punk fued, and they predicted the cash in. And WWE is going on a mexican tour, and actually, now that I think about it, a fued between Del Rio and Punk, in Mexico, sounds pretty awesome. And the fact that Punk would be the challenger and not the champion makes it better.

(I seriously need to uncapitalize my screename holy crap it's bugging me)

[RedWizard]

Out of morbid curiosity, I decided to tune into RAW tonight. I just watched the exchange between Kevin Nash and that Punk guy.

This Punk character is supposed to be popular?

... can I ask why?



More importantly, where are the cool characters, like Undertaker, Jake the Snake Roberts, and Ultimo Dragon?

[UmberHulk]

CM Punk rules.

Taker comes and goes these days.

[AlucardsFate]

Sorry, I couldn't visit this thread till now since I hadn't watched Summerslam.

I am actually really confused by a lot of it. Christian has the title for a month...for apparently no reason.

Del Rio wins the belt, I mean he's a good heel and all but in the ring I don't think he can keep up with a CM Punk. I haven't seen any really REMARKABLE wrestling out of him. And Nash? Well I guess they are paying him so he's gotta do something.

Out of morbid curiosity, I decided to tune into RAW tonight. I just watched the exchange between Kevin Nash and that Punk guy.

This Punk character is supposed to be popular?

... can I ask why?

Shut it. Punk is the best thing going since...god since forever at this point. Goofy character driven stuff doesn't work anymore Ed. Besides, Punk paid tribute to Randy Savage in his match...he's my hero.

[SnakeEyez]

Out of morbid curiosity, I decided to tune into RAW tonight. I just watched the exchange between Kevin Nash and that Punk guy.

This Punk character is supposed to be popular?

... can I ask why?

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[UmberHulk]

In ring, I like Del Rio a lot more than Punk. Punk's better on the Mike, and he's been awesome ever since he went all crazy jesus two years ago. Del Rio's amazing though; the shit that he does at his size is awesome.

Punk vs Nash started off good. Loved the text message quip. Ended awkward.

ALSO JOHN CENA JUST DIE OR TURN HEEL ALREADY

CM punk's diet soda

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuqND-aYC4U

[AlucardsFate]

In ring, I like Del Rio a lot more than Punk.

You've lost your mind. Like...downed a whole bottle of Liquid-Drano lost your mind.

Now that I saw Raw and Smackdown, I'm all caught up! Raw was fairly uneventful (though poor Rey got shafted...AGAIN. But everyone gets humiliated in their hometown, it's a wrestling fact) though the Punk vs Nash promo was entertaining. And it allowed me to think a bit on the whole idea of this feud:

-This is the natural progression for Punk's insider underdog fighting the system character I think. He took on the company poster boy. Now he takes on a symbol of the "good ol boys" of the wrestling Renaissance, the stable of guys that took the top spots and held down the younger performers. Since Hogan is basically broken, Hall is...broken in other ways Nash is really the only choice left. It is for this reason I think that this feud is a great idea.

-This is why it isn't such a good idea. Nash is old. This doesn't stop some wrestlers (after all Ric Flair is still semi-active) but Nash has the added knock against him of having those fragile big man knees. I take nothing away from the guy, he is a great performer in all aspects but he's just physically not going to be able to run with Punk in a match. (95-2001? ABSOLUTELY) This can only lead to Punk having to slow down for him. An option I don't like. (Remember how The Rock had to slow it up for Hogan some years ago?) Maybe Nash can surprise me. I sure hope he can.

[UmberHulk]

I lost my mind a long, long time ago, but that has nothing with Del Rio being amazing in ring. He has extremly cool looking kicks and an awesome finisher. And we need more wrestlers who looks to make their opponents tap out. Hell, his on the rope kick counter looks more convincing than any one thing that Punk does. Punk does some athletic stuff which is cool, but also dumb (it comes with the package, but it is).

Punk's demeanor when he's in ring is super awesome, though.

EDIT: Oh god, I can't believe I typed "mike." The Rock needs to make fun of me.

[SnakeEyez]

Well, Bound for Glory is tomorrow, so I suppose I'll try to do a bit of predictifying.

TNA Tag Team Championship: Mexican America (c) vs. Ink Inc.
Tough call. Ink Inc. just came back a few weeks ago, so it would seem kind of odd to put the tag titles on them right away. Still, since this match is supposed to open up the PPV, it makes sense to have the good guys win to start the show on a positive note. This one could go either way, but I'll go ahead and say that we have new tag champs.
Winners: Ink Inc.

Full Metal Mayhem Match: Rob Van Dam vs. Jerry Lynn
The Philadelphia crowd is going to love this match, lemme tell ya. No matter how many times these two wrestle each other, they always put on a good show. I'll side with RVD just because it's RVD and he tends to win most of his matches in TNA.
Winner: RVD

Samoa Joe vs. Matt Morgan vs. Crimson
I'd love to see Samoa Joe win and turn into a badass again, but I think TNA is dead-set on making Crimson their next big star. Can't say I'm too disappointed, though, since I kinda like Crimson.
Winner: Crimson

Falls Count Anywhere Match: Bully Ray vs. Mr. Anderson
I feel tempted to say that the recently ostracized Abyss makes an impact in this match and helps Anderson pick up the victory. However, we do need to have some heels win here and there, and Bully Ray is one of the best heels in TNA right now. I think he'll find a way to steal another win in the most underhanded and cowardly way possible.
Winner: Bully Ray

TNA Knockouts Championship: Winter (c) vs. Mickie James vs. Velvet Sky vs. Madison Rayne
All signs point to Velvet Sky winning the Knockouts title. They've been teasing it all summer, and this seems like as good a place as any to pull the trigger and give her the championship. This title change would have been a lot more impactful and meaningful if Winter and Mickie James hadn't been playing Hot Potato with the belt over the past few months, but that's TNA for you.
Winner: Velvet Sky

TNA X Division Championship: Austin Aries (c) vs. Brian Kendrick
As much as I like Kendrick, it's time for Aries to shine. He's the kind of guy you can build a division around, and I don't foresee his reign as X-Division Champion ending anytime soon.
Winner: Austin Aries

No Disqualification Match: Hulk Hogan vs. Sting
Hang on, let me get my *Cornette Face* ready. What is this, 1989? Why is this match happening again? Hogan has had half a dozen back surgeries over the past few years and likely can't even fall down without breaking something. Sting won't be able to carry this whole match by himself, that's for sure. And since this is a No Disqualification match and since this is TNA, you already know that this thing is going to degenerate into a clusterfuck of outside interference and mid-match run-ins. Expect to see interference from Immortal, Jeff Hardy, Fortune, The Nexus, The Main Event Mafia, The Brood, Demolition, Kaientai, The Spirit Squad, Team Canada, The Ministry of Darkness, The Dungeon of Doom, The Blue World Order, The Power Rangers, Bill & Ted, The Muppets, and The Harlem Globetrotters before this match is over. Oh, and Sting wins.
Winner: Sting

"I Quit" Match: AJ Styles vs. Christopher Daniels
Everything I said about RVD vs. Jerry Lynn applies to Styles and Daniels. These guys wrestle each other all the time, but they always have a great match together. For this one, I'm actually going to go against my better judgment and pick Christopher Daniels. This looks to be the start of a long-term feud between the two, which is okay in my book. Since this is an I Quit match, they'll have to come up with some creative way to get AJ to give up. Maybe get Kazarian involved in there somewhere? I don't know. Should be a great match either way.
Winner: Christopher Daniels

TNA Championship: Kurt Angle (c) vs. Robert Roode
Part of me wants to scoff at how obvious and predictable the outcome of this match is. They've been hyping up Robert Roode as the next world champion for months now. He's gotten all these video packages highlighting his desire to become a world champion, he's been picking up victories against absolutely everybody, and TNA has really been pushing him as their next big breakout star. I mean, come on, how could he possibly lose after all the build-up? That's when I remember that this is TNA we're talking about here. I can never tell what they're going to do. Hell, I don't think even they know what they're going to do most of the time. Even the most predictable match outcome is never a sure bet when the TNA booking crew is in charge. Still, all things considered, Roode is likely walking away from this match with the championship. I can't say for certain, of course, but I think this is his time to shine.
Winner: Robert Roode


EDIT: Looks like I went 5-4. Hrm. I can live with that, I guess.

[AlucardsFate]

I haven't watched a TNA anything...in forever. (Probably since Daffney left...kinda odd how those two went hand in hand) It occurred to me that I don't know which one Robert Roode actually is. He's either the dude with the cowboy hat or the one that hangs out with the dude with the cowboy hat. It's nice to see them pushing a younger guy though. (Even if I'm not sure which younger guy he is)

Sweet Jesus Jerry Lynn hasn't hung it up yet!? Though I guess he's comparatively young next to a certain OTHER three on the TNA roster. Styles and Daniels had to be really good, I may go back and find that if I don't forget. Though your the second person to say how awesome Bubba Ray has gotten. (I can't call him "Bully Ray" it's a really stupid name and it reminds me of when Jim Ross used to call Vader a bully. So much in fact, that it ended up in one of his Titantrons....didn't do Vader any favors) And him wrestling the overrated Anderson doesn't help him. People claim it's gotten better, though maybe I'll give them another shot sometime. (Though not in Jan, 30Rock premieres then. It get's priority)

*Reads over Vengeance results

Did they really do the ring collapse thing? Ugh...seems like a fairly worthless PPV. Just something to get us through the next month. But at least Cena lost, that's always a good day. (Though it means I can look forward to a Cena speech sometime tomorrow night...oh joy) Man it really seems like they are wasting all that steam Punk built up this year. That sucks, though it wasn't entirely unexpected. What's amazed me, is I am actually kinda liking seeing Mark Henry as champ. (Though since they kinda combined the shows anyway they really should just have one title) They are selling him as a legitimate force. The other almighty, ridiculous, unbeatable guy on par with Cena in Randy Orton...CAN'T BEAT HIM. He tries...and ol' Mark throws him into the floor. I can dig that. (And yeah I dislike Orton almost as much as Cena now) Though what I was noticing just recently, WWE announcers don't really call matches anymore do they? They don't call out moves or describe the action. They just ramble on about this and that that has everything to do with everything but wrestling. It has gotten so bad that when they actually decided to try and call a move or two during the Sin Cara vs Sin Cara match, they were audibly unsure of what to say. Ya know what it reminds me of? Tony Shcivonne (Spelling?), Larry Zybysko and Mike Tenay on Nitro. Talking heads. That really sucks. No wonder they didn't want JR at the desk, he might actually try to call a move or two...

[ShinNatsume]

I wish they would stop with the F'N Jim Ross bullcrap, they've been screwing this poor bloke around for far to long. He's a company man and has done nothing but GIVE to the industry! The reason he is loved and respected is because of this, he gives a great sound to commentary, and notice the roster was better when Jim Ross had the talent relations job instead of John Laryngitis? I wouldn't mind if it was all story line, but it's not. Fucking sick of it.

[AlucardsFate]

Maryse was released today. That sucks. They get rid of one of the ladies I actually kinda like and Alica Fox still has a job. The world continues to be unfair.

[ShinNatsume]

Maryse can look hot and wrestle poorly anywhere, and get a shitty name in TNA.
"The French Maid makes her way in to the impact zone!"

And assuming John Morrison should be released soon, I'll go a head and say.
"Johnny Impact is in the impact zone!"

RELLIK's Name backwards is KILLER! ZOMG! - Fuck that company. >_>

[AlucardsFate]

Maryse wasn't bad! She wasn't any kind of amazing wrestler but she had potential and she was a good heel...as long as she wasn't speaking English.

I don't hate TNA, I just hate some of the people that work there. I stopped paying attention right around the time Hogan showed up. There is so much potential down there in terms of talented wrestlers, but they refuse to really do anything with them. (Or at least that was the case last I watched them)

[ShinNatsume]

TNA died in the second half of 2006, to think just back in 2005 there PPV's where the best to be seen, period. The product since then has become absolutely dreadful

WWE's pissing me off, they have CM Punk, the hottest thing in YEARS after that promo he cut, and fuck it up by putting Triple H and Kevin Nash in the storyline, two guys past there prime, master politics who get there names involved STILL with the hottest name in wrestling today, or at least he was until they had Triple H go over him, not give him a chance to get a win back, and then having them act like BEST FRIENDS!?!?

Not long ago CM Punk was insulting him, insulting his wife, saying it wasn't professional, it was personal, using each others real name, now they are the bestest buddies, they have dropped the ball big time with him. Hopefully they put him over Alberto Del Rio. Seriously though Alberto, for someone who has been given that much of a huge push, he is not over like he should be. The term "X-Pac heat" springs to mind at times. CM Punk how ever is over, and honestly needs the belt before he is forgotten about.

[AlucardsFate]

Oh well they rely on the now younger fanbase to have incredibly short term memories. I surprised that when The Rock shows up that they even know who he is.

[ShinNatsume]

To some degree they don't know who he is, compare the pops between 2003 and now.
Anyhoo there idiots for having The Rock wrestle at Survivor Series, the selling point for Mania was The Rock returning for the first time in several years to in ring action!

[SnakeEyez]

I wouldn't say that. The Rock hasn't wrestled a match since 2004, and even The Great One is going to suffer some ring rust after such a long absence. He needs a few big matches under his belt between now and Wrestlemania just so he can get back into the groove. Survivor Series seems like a good place to start.

Having said that, I can't say I'm particularly excited to see Rock vs. Cena despite all the hype it's gotten (and is going to keep getting over the next few months). I just don't care all that much. I'd much rather see John Cena vs. Undertaker at Wrestlemania, personally. Taker is shooting for 20-0 and Cena is the only wrestler left on the roster who actually poses a threat to the streak. Lost opportunity, if you ask me.

[ShinNatsume]

Ring Rust? Shawn Michaels return match against Triple H says hi. But meh not everyone can be the greatest in ring performer of all time can they?

I was a lot more buzzed for The Rocks return last year, honestly they should of just had The Rock return to host this years Mania instead and then turn it in to The Rock Vs John Cena. Anyhoo if I wanted any match up it would be CM Punk Vs Steve Austin.

[AlucardsFate]

I wouldn't say that. The Rock hasn't wrestled a match since 2004, and even The Great One is going to suffer some ring rust after such a long absence. He needs a few big matches under his belt between now and Wrestlemania just so he can get back into the groove. Survivor Series seems like a good place to start.

Having said that, I can't say I'm particularly excited to see Rock vs. Cena despite all the hype it's gotten (and is going to keep getting over the next few months). I just don't care all that much. I'd much rather see John Cena vs. Undertaker at Wrestlemania, personally. Taker is shooting for 20-0 and Cena is the only wrestler left on the roster who actually poses a threat to the streak. Lost opportunity, if you ask me.

I would never want that. Aside from just hating Cena, I know that they wouldn't want him to lose a match...cleanly...ever for any reason so he'd break it and that would be just horrible.

[UmberHulk]

Undertaker vs DX

Undertaker wins!

[SnakeEyez]

Ring Rust? Shawn Michaels return match against Triple H says hi. But meh not everyone can be the greatest in ring performer of all time can they?
Yeeeeeah...that's not really the best comparison. Triple H and Shawn Michaels are best friends who have wrestled each other dozens of times before. Of course they're going to have a good match together even if one of them goes a few years without wrestling. Rock and Cena aren't even close to that level of familiarity and they've never wrestled before. That's why Rock needs a few matches under his belt to get ready.

I would never want that. Aside from just hating Cena, I know that they wouldn't want him to lose a match...cleanly...ever for any reason so he'd break it and that would be just horrible.
Thank you for proving my point. Cena is the only guy on the roster who poses a threat to the streak. Undertaker vs. absolutely anybody else at Wrestlemania is predictable at this point because you already know that Taker is going to win. Except Cena. He could win. That's why the match would be a good idea -- the anticipation would make it worthwhile.

But the match isn't happening, so I'm just wasting my time talking about it anyway.

[AlucardsFate]

But I'm an overly biased prig who just never...ever wants to see John Cena ever again.

[UmberHulk]

The match itself is a lot more important to me than the result. So fuck Cena.

[AlucardsFate]

Well I have no doubt that the match itself would be at least good. If there is one single person EVER that knows about making a good match when your opponent is mind numbingly horrible...it's The Undertaker. He's been doing it since he got to the WWF/WWE.

[UmberHulk]

Still, CM Punk vs Taker would be more fun, and I think Taker has the best chemistry against undersized wrestlers, and the second best chemistry against people just as big. In between guys like Cena/rock/HHH/Orton/whatever are generally his least entertaining matchup, in my opinion.

[ShinNatsume]

Well I have no doubt that the match itself would be at least good. If there is one single person EVER that knows about making a good match when your opponent is mind numbingly horrible...it's The Undertaker. He's been doing it since he got to the WWF/WWE.

Shawn Michaels, he got a decent match out of The Great Khali, at least much better than what The Undertaker got out the guys. The Undertaker managed to carry Batista to some good matches though.

Regarding John Cena, in recent years I've had a change of heart about the guys, I don't hate him. I just get tired of him in the main event scene. He isn't a HORRIBLE wrestler either, most talent including the internet darling as Michael Cole calls him Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson uses a "five moves of doom" himself, that's just WWE's style. And the reality of it is, if John Cena wants to deliver, he can. Shawn Michaels Vs John Cena. - CM Punk Vs John Cena. He's had some fantastic bouts with Edge. Some semi-decent with Randy Orton. He isn't terrible at all, and if you think that you've simply fell in to the category of hating John Cena due to him being over booked and in your face, as once I did.

So on point, John Cena Vs The Undertaker would be a great bout, not because The Undertaker is just that good, but because when he needs to, John Cena can work a damn good match. Besides that, it's the only match that would of made sense for the Undertaker to have at Mania!

[AlucardsFate]

No...the "Five moves of doom" is all Cena has. Yeah, most WWE guys use it, but the difference is they can do other things. Randy Orton is the best example...he is as big a spot monkey as Cena, but I know he can do better. (Though it's actually more frustrating for me because Orton can actually wrestle and he just doesn't. That is somehow worse to me)

Relevant: Cena vs Taker:
*Fun fact, I was in the crowd for this match. Though you can't see me (No pun intended) because I was way in the upper deck.

Part 1:
oxO0tUnKXc8

Part 2:
tFKhmmE0wFk
*This thread is so active all the sudden. I'm diggin it.

[ShinNatsume]

If you refuse to believe that's all he has than you're being ignorant and blinded by your bias towards the man. And proved a portion of my previous post in regards to a category you have fell in to.

CM Punk Vs John Cena was a fantastic match and showed Cena can work if he has to.
In addition to that, partly the reason Cena only uses the five moves of doom, is due to the 7 points of wrestling. The 7 points of wrestling is how a match is built, and when you're wrestling a 5 minute match on RAW week in and week out, theirs only so much you're going to do, hence why he has this over and preset moveset, because it gets a pop.

Here is the seven points.
1.Shine - Babyface shows a little of what he can do.
2.Cut off - The heel cuts off the face.
3.Heat - The heel works the heat for a while.
4.Come back - The face shows signs of coming back.

Cut off again and more heat normally takes place, there may be other comes backs and cut off depending on the length of the match.

5. Double Down - This is optional and doesn't happen in every match, it's when both wrestlers hit each other with a move or something along those lines and make there way up to there feet before the 10 count.

6. Fire - It has many names but this is generally the come back moment where Cena would do his five moves of doom.

7. Finish - The finish of the match, self explanatory.

9/10 most wrestling matches follow this, unless they've hacked one or two of the steps out, the heat of the match and come backs make up a match, which is dictated by the heel, in addition the pace is set by the heel. So sure he will use the five moves of doom in his matches leading up to the finish, but the rest of his matches are dictated by the heel.

As a result with limited time and come backs in matches on Raw with limited time, matches are the same old crap, hence why his PPV matches are always better, and not that bad. The reason people always have a negative tone about even his PPV matches is because the WWE books him to never look remotely bad.

You and many others are blinded by the WWE's terrible booking in to thinking Cena is worse than he is, and honestly he isn't, and if you don't see that, well meh sucks to be you.

[AlucardsFate]

Oh well now, no need for name callin. :D I'll admit up and down to being biased against Cena. Absolutely. Damn proud of it too! Not all of us are actual wrestlers, some of us are just everyday, money spending fans. (Their target audience! *Sometimes) So I've never wrestled a match, doesn't mean Cena isn't formulaic and boring. (An that's by modern day WWE standards, so that's saying a lot)

[ShinNatsume]

I didn't mean to sound insulting honestly, perhaps the wrong choice of words, apologies. I think I pretty much proved my point about Cena's wrestling ability though. Never said John Cena wasn't boring, I actually can't stand watching him, I dislike his character in general and his matches on RAW due to what I said previously.

But I will be fair and defend his abilities.

[UmberHulk]

Shoulder block shoulder block shoulder block

[ShinNatsume]

Ah, always with productive input I see.

[UmberHulk]

I don't disagree with anything you said.

I really hate that shoulder block combo, though.

[ShinNatsume]

So I love how The Rock made his RAW return live via satellite... again.

[ChukoLiang]

So I haven't watched wrestling since, what, 1998?

I have a healthy respect for people big enough to easily pound me into dirt, especially when instead of beating the fuck out of people in boxing or, say, some kind of MMA, willingly sacrifice their bodies, their health, and in many cases their ability to have any kind of self respect in public (it would seem), knowing full well that the likely end result is they'll either die quite young or waste away with zero attention.

That takes some serious dedication.

When I found out spoony had been doing a wrestling review show, it sounded interesting. I'd already watched almost all his videos, some far, far too many times (I'm fairly sure I saw every FFVIII video about 7 times now) so new material to have something to listen to in the background sounded a good idea.

I never really understood how beyond taxing this profession must be to people in it. If you're not a face, there will inevitably be stupid assholes who'll throw shit at you. You'll have a rough time in public because you're always your character, always. You'll have to deal with severe injuries, the ever-present potential for violent, horrifying and public accident-related death, and above all, odds are almost certain no matter how talented or dedicated you may be you'll forever (it seems) be overshadowed by hacks that are talentless douchebags that inexplicably sell merch and thus are invincible.

It really seems like one of the worst jobs imaginable. It just shows how crazy dedicated these people are that they can deal with this shit. Wrestling's on year-round, right? It's not like they take a couple months off a year. Shit is ridiculous. What really pushed this beyond "Yeah, it sounds like a shitty job" to "oh my god, what the hell are we doing to these people?" was when I heard a reference to a specific practice. So I looked it up on wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blading_(professional_wrestling)

holy fuck. That's insane. I can't imagine what I'd have to be paid to willingly fuck up my own forehead with a goddamn razor blade with the intent to be to cause severe bleeding, hoping I don't fucking die from it. That's fucked up beyond belief. And it's not like these guys are getting paid like goddamn football players. I realize that's a physically demanding sport as well, but I don't remember hearing about a quarterback fucking cutting up his goddamn face to make a better show for an audience.

These people, whether the results are fixed or not, are the modern gladiators. They put on a show of combat, with weapons, with fists, with brute force and incredible skill and finesse, and people fucking die doing this. And what do they get paid? How many football players keep playing professionally at the age some of these guys are? Insane.

I'm not a big fan of how this stuff works, if we're being honest. I really wish they just had a show I could watch once a week, an hour or two, no story, no talking, no bullshit, just a bunch of people putting on a great show of beating the fuck out of each other while somehow not murdering each other.

This is some insanity. I wouldn't do that kind of shit if I was getting paid like a goddamn NFL player. These guys can't possibly be making that kind of money, so whatever they say they must keep doing this because they enjoy it, either that or they really can't do anything else. Which, well, there's another problem that goes with that. You can't do this job and then go work at a used car lot or something.

Nuts.

I still can't get over that blading shit. I always thought they had blood packets or something. Fuuuck. I can't even imagine how much money I'd need to willingly fuck my own body up with a razor at all, let alone like these guys do.

Yeah, the stories aren't interesting at all to me, but I really gotta respect this entire industry of people. Anyway. I figured that could be my one contribution to this thread.


oh, if you guys wanna see what spoony has to say on wrestling (very little of it is positive so far, but he's mostly hitting TNA, so whatever, I haven't seen anything but WCW waaaay back) it's at this website: www.wrestlewrestle.com

[SnakeEyez]

Survivor Series is sometimes billed as the start of the Road to Wrestlemania, so it looks like it's time for us to start getting excited about pro wrestling's Super Bowl.

John Cena vs. The Rock is already set in stone, and judging by the reaction they got during the tag match at Survivor Series, it looks like that one should live up to expectations. Rock looks like he's in great shape and the reports say that he's taking this match seriously, so I'm sure he'll bring it. Cena, too, can pull out a few new tricks and put on a good match when he needs to (see Cena vs. Punk at Money in the Bank, for example).

They seem to be teasing some sort of feud between Mark Henry and Daniel Bryan, so I think that could make a great David vs. Goliath match at Wrestlemania. I'm sure they can keep Henry's momentum going until then. They've already started booking Bryan as the underdog who might just stand a fighting chance against the big grizzly bear, so as long as they keep that up, they should have a good rivalry going on.

As for the WWE Title, I would love to see a feud between CM Punk and Dolph Ziggler. I think Mr. Ziggles is just about ready for the main event scene. He just needs to drop the US Title (probably to Zack Ryder since he's gotten so incredibly popular over the past year) and start knocking off some big names as he guns for Punk's title. Maybe Ziggler can even win the Royal Rumble. Either way, I think Punk vs. Ziggler could be a great feud since they're both so talented.

And Undertaker needs one more match at 'Mania...but I'll be damned if I know who his opponent is gonna be. I said previously that John Cena is the only good choice left, but he's occupied with Rock. Orton has been done before, Triple H has been done twice before, Mark Henry and CM Punk should be occupied, Big Show has been done before...not sure who else it could be. Wade Barrett, maybe? Or Alberto Del Rio? Cody Rhodes? The Miz? Maybe someone else entirely? Too early to tell.

*long post*

That's why it grinds my gears when people say that professional wrestling is "fake." It's staged, not fake. There's a huge difference between the two. These guys and girls really do beat the crap out of each other night after night. They really do get banged up and suffer serious injuries and straight-up mutilate themselves just to put on a good show. There's nothing fake about it. It's not fake when they fall off a ten-foot ladder or crash into the guard rail or get whacked on the head with a metal chair.

Your post reminded me that we should appreciate the sacrifices they make for the fans, so thank you for the reminder. It's far too easy for wrestling fans like us to take it for granted.

[ShinNatsume]

Thought I'd drop my 2 cents on the comments before me.

During my time on the indy scene, all I can say is that I'm use to people saying it's fake that often that it not longer phases me, I'd rather not even go in to the long dispute about it anymore, I just shrug my shoulders and go. "Yea it's fake, but I enjoy doing it." It'll be the same approach I take when I'm healed up, healthier and prepared to go back in to wrestling the USA.

People are stupid and uneducated and that's fine. And honestly whilst it "grinds the gears" of many wrestling fans far and wind. What they need to understand is, whilst we're taking the bumps in there, which of course leave you sore after SOME matches. And of course the bumps and bruises add up over time, for example my knees are absolutely awful at the age of twenty now in comparison to when I started at sixteen. We're having a fight which is not real, so you can call it staged, you can call it fake, use whatever word you want for it, the uneducated fans are not going to understand what goes on behind it all. What we do in the ring is what it is, it's not real. It's a performance peace which takes athleticism, dedication and a lot of risks. Let the people who enjoy it, enjoy it, and let the uneducated insulting idiots be just that. It's frickin' pro wrestling, why so serious?

And regarding steel chair shots to the head, WWE banned them due to the Chris Benoit junk due to the fact he would take a chair shot with out bumping it, then just drop to the ground, also he took them to the back of the head. Which is the wrong and dangerous way of doing it and it left him screwed up. Raven has mentioned and I agreed, if you take a chair shot and bump it right, you barely feel it. It's good timing, but then again everything has to be good timing in pro wrestling or you end up looking sloppy, ask Mistico. Anyhoo the point the chair shots are not that much of an issue if you're trained correctly.

On the blading subject, the cuts to make yourself bleed on the forehead are not that big, normally if you do the tiniest hemline cut, y'know by the hair where it won't be seen to much, you'll bleed like a stuffed pig with out much damage to your flesh.
It's people like Shawn and Triple H who're bleeders who are digging blades in a little to far, I mean look at Triple H's forehead on HD, URGH. That being said it's a horrible experience, especially the first time listening to your flesh make a horrid noise, slicing... EW... Plus I won't blade anymore in indie feds due to people having Hepatitis and shit. Maybe if I ever make it big.

[SnakeEyez]

And regarding steel chair shots to the head, WWE banned them due to the Chris Benoit junk due to the fact he would take a chair shot with out bumping it, then just drop to the ground, also he took them to the back of the head. Which is the wrong and dangerous way of doing it and it left him screwed up. Raven has mentioned and I agreed, if you take a chair shot and bump it right, you barely feel it. It's good timing, but then again everything has to be good timing in pro wrestling or you end up looking sloppy, ask Mistico. Anyhoo the point the chair shots are not that much of an issue if you're trained correctly.

Yeah, I know. I was talking about chair shots in general, not just chair shots in the WWE.


EDIT: No. Correcting you isn't even worth the effort.

[ShinNatsume]

WWE' 12 pretty fun and smooth, how does everyone like it?... Assuming they have.

[AlucardsFate]

I hear it's better this year but I always hear that. And $60 is too much to justify buying it.

[UmberHulk]

Cm Punk vs Taker would be cool. And they should have it more focused on Punk's title defense than the streak for the streak's sake. At some point, every wrestler saying "I'm gonna end the streak!" is going to feel like a parody of itself, in my opinion.

Or Punk vs Austin.

[SnakeEyez]

Here's an entertaining interview with The Miz on the day before Thanksgiving.

mt-wfgcMA8s

He talks about CM Punk, Zack Ryder (including the origin of his "Woo Woo Woo -- You Know It" catchphrase), his match at Survivor Series, whether he ever considered going to TNA, how he's spending Thanksgiving weekend, how much sleep he gets, The Rock, his disdain for McDonald's, his favorite arenas to compete in, his favorite matches, and a whole lot more. Definitely worth watching if you're a Miz fan.

[AlucardsFate]

I love that his character is just a super exploded version of himself. Even in interviews like this he's kinda obnoxious but ultimately a lot of fun.

Now we need a CM Punk vs Miz title fued. I'd love that. The promos would be fantastic...

[ShinNatsume]

Meh, The Miz is incredibly over rated on the microphone, all his promos are pretty much the same, he rarely shows emotion and the only thing he's established is "Really" and "AWWWEEEESOME".

Honestly it showed during The Awesome Truth team how inferior he was in comparison to guys like R-Truth who is on another level to Miz and generally a large chunk of the WWE guys. Truths Microphone work was so over. The fans are really in to it, until the moment The Miz talks, then suddenly they go quieter.

Don't get me wrong, I think The Miz is a good talker, but he's body of work on the microphone is over rated, a few promos above his general average doesn't change that. The guy just needs to stick to developing his in ring ability so he can hang with guys like Punk, and not stink up a main event like he did with Cena at Mania.

On the subject of guys who actually suck on the microphone...
What the hell happened to Kevin Nash, his skills has diminished, it's like... EW.

And another subject, do you think we've seen the ground works for a Cena heel turn from the Pipers Pit?

[AlucardsFate]

Overrated? Nobody can send a crowd into a frenzy like he can. I always liken him to Chris Jericho without the in ring ability. (If he could get to that level that would be amazing)

[ShinNatsume]

Overrated? Nobody can send a crowd into a frenzy like he can. I always liken him to Chris Jericho without the in ring ability. (If he could get to that level that would be amazing)

Yes, the heel Chris Jericho of his last one, the one with no charisma that cut the exact same promo calling people hypocrites and parasites week in and week out whilst wearing a suit.

Much how Miz cuts the same promo week in and week out whilst sometimes wearing a suit, other than that The Miz can't touch Chris Jericho on the microphone if you look at his past work.

And again, R-Truth is better on the microphone, you see it when there side by side, he'll get the loudest heel reaction of the night, fans go quiet when Miz gets back on the stick after Truth is done. He's a good promo guy, don't get me wrong, but he's an over rated promo guy.

Zack Ryder, R-Truth, CM Punk, Triple H, Vickie Guerrero, Christian, The Undertaker (When he is aloud to really talk) and Wade Barrett. I think I listed the best talkers there, The Miz is only better than 1 to 2 of them. =/

Edit: And thinking about it Big Show's mic work has been getting bigger pops on Smackdown as of late, Cody Rhodes is not far and during Mark Henrys heel run at the title at the start, his delivery was one of the best.

[AlucardsFate]

Wait...you don't like Chris Jericho? He is one of the very few all around "Good at everything" guys I've ever had the privilege to see. He can have a good match with anybody and always be an interesting character. Soo...he was on Dancing With the Stars and I don't really care for his band. (I suppose they aren't bad, just...eh) Chris Jericho is one of my absolute favorites. I'm so happy I've gotten to see him live at least once and he was really the only thing that ever really caused me to flip to WCW back in the day. (I did watch Nitro during commercials but that was it outside of looking for the Jericho matches and antics. Sometimes I would just watch the later replay)

But...not liking Jericho is just mind boggling. I'm not sure I can even process that.

[ShinNatsume]

I never said "I don't like Chris Jericho."
What I'm saying, his last heel run got stale after his Shawn Michaels feud, same old crap week in and week out, he became stale.

[AlucardsFate]

Oh well he wasn't really working toward anything at that point, he was taking another hiatus to work on his outside projects. At that point you become a good heel to push others against.

Whew...for a second there I thought we were going to have to fight.

[UmberHulk]

I like The Miz. One of his older promos during his feud w/ MVP was pretty solid.

[ShinNatsume]

Why can't I get hyped for Cena and The Rock? =/

100th post.

[AlucardsFate]

100th post eh? And we actually have a couple of other posters in here aside from Brian and I? Well to mark both of those occasions, what say we play a little game. The wrasslin site I visit does this among it's editors, so if you want we could try it to.

Basically, as each WWE PPV comes up they all try to predict the outcomes of each match. You get a point for every match you correctly predict. Nothing at stake but bragging rights for being the smartest fan. Of course this would put us on the honor system of avoiding spoilers. (which I do anyway because I like to be surprised) Anyone interested in trying this with the upcoming TLC PPV? (I figure that's a pretty low end PPV to test it on)

[ShinNatsume]

Count me in! Perhaps we should do it in a different thread to tidy it up, with the card for the upcoming show on the main page.

[SnakeEyez]

I like making predictions for the big shows like Wrestlemania and Bound for Glory, but I never really bothered with the lesser Pay-Per-Views since it didn't seem like it was worth the effort. If I'm not the only one doing it, though, then maybe it'll be worth my while. I'll try my hand at predictifying the TLC PPV in a couple weeks.

[AlucardsFate]

Count me in! Perhaps we should do it in a different thread to tidy it up, with the card for the upcoming show on the main page.

I dunno if I need to make a new thread, that feels like kind of a waste doesn't it? And having to constantly go back to page one to update that first post would be annoying.

I like making predictions for the big shows like Wrestlemania and Bound for Glory, but I never really bothered with the lesser Pay-Per-Views since it didn't seem like it was worth the effort. If I'm not the only one doing it, though, then maybe it'll be worth my while. I'll try my hand at predictifying the TLC PPV in a couple weeks.

I was actually going to suggest this for the Royal Rumble since it's important, but I figured if we are going to have kinks it's best to iron them out now on the "meh" PPV.

Also Brian, since your a mod I had a brainstorm regarding this at work today. (in the bathroom of all places) What if we had a forum "Wrestling Champion" badge that the current overall leader would get to wear. Ya know, it get's passed around depending on who has the best record? That would be neat.

As far as the rules go, we should decide those before we start of course, so basically I was thinking this: (Feel free to offer suggestions)

- I'll post the card the Sat before the event (Though maybe Friday would work better, whichever you guys wanna do)

- Your record would just be tallied in a traditional Win/Loss fashion. (Example: 4-2 = 4 Correct, 2 Incorrect)

- Your record for that show would be listed but also your record over the course of the year would be tallied to see how we stack up against each other over the long haul.

- You don't necessarily have to explain your reason for choosing one way over another. (Though feel free to) But you DO have to pick an outcome for EVERY match on the card. Blanks will count as an incorrect.

- Matches that end in some other fashion outside of determining a clear winner, (Example: Double Disqualification, Double Countout) Will simply be counted as zeros. Nobody will gain or lose on those.

- If for some reason a match is changed in some drastic way at the last second, (Example: one person is replaced by another) Will be counted as zeros. My reasoning here is "What if you picked the guy that got replaced?"

Finally, I had a couple of special ideas I wanted to throw out there:

- Matches like The Royal Rumble match, and it's 30(+) entrants will be stacked against us in terms of probability. So what if correctly guessing the winner of the Royal Rumble match counted as say 5? Incorrect guesses would still be -1.

- What if correctly guessing EVERY match on a given card carried 1 bonus point with it?

- When The Elimination Chamber comes up, (or a similar elimination based affair) what if you gained a bonus point for every person you correctly guessed the order they would be eliminated? You list the order in which you think they are getting eliminated and for every one that falls in the correct spot you get a point. You don't have to get the ones before or after to get the bonus point. 1 point per correct guess. *I figure something like that could be optional. You don't have to them, you don't get knocked for not doing it, but it's a great opportunity to gain some ground.

- Did you want to do TNA Wrestling as well? I know Brian (May) still watch them. I don't, but Shin and if Umberhulk joins in too and you all want to I will do that to and give it my best.

Whaddia think?

[SnakeEyez]

Before I answer any specific questions, let me start by asking whether this is something you're actually serious about doing. Are you really going to take the time to compile the match card before every single Pay-Per-View and tally all of our scores for an entire year? Because I'll only participate if you are. It sounds like a neat idea and I'd definitely be interested in being a part of it, but only if I can rest easy knowing that the person running it is reliable, consistent, and committed to seeing it through to the end.

[AlucardsFate]

Absofruitly. I'm not worried about the commitment at all. I've taken on other much larger, more demanding commitments in the past. Putting together all those splash screens and match descriptions together twice a week was much worse then typing this up once a month. (Twice if you count before and after show) If I can't handle that I would think I need some kind of time management specialist. Especially since I don't work weekends ever so I have nothing but time on Friday. (Saturday is sometimes up in the air for various reasons, which is why I figure Friday would likely work better. Smackdown ends at 8pm here so I figure it should all be pretty locked in by then. I totally get what you are worried about though, I know you've seen so many tournaments and things go nowhere and just stop.

[ShinNatsume]

Regarding the TNA subject.

Fuck TNA. :)

I'm happy to participate in WWE related games, especially since 2011 has been the best year in the last five. But I won't support TNA remotely, be it profit or non-profit.

They took something amazing from 2005, a time they set PPV records and had fantastic wrestling and shit all over it. I consider ROH and Chikara bigger and better.

[SnakeEyez]

Absofruitly. I'm not worried about the commitment at all. I've taken on other much larger, more demanding commitments in the past. Putting together all those splash screens and match descriptions together twice a week was much worse then typing this up once a month. (Twice if you count before and after show) If I can't handle that I would think I need some kind of time management specialist. Especially since I don't work weekends ever so I have nothing but time on Friday. (Saturday is sometimes up in the air for various reasons, which is why I figure Friday would likely work better. Smackdown ends at 8pm here so I figure it should all be pretty locked in by then. I totally get what you are worried about though, I know you've seen so many tournaments and things go nowhere and just stop.
Mrf. Okay, but if we aren't still predicting Pay-Per-Views by this time next year, I reserve the right to quote this post and say "I told you so."

Also Brian, since your a mod I had a brainstorm regarding this at work today. (in the bathroom of all places) What if we had a forum "Wrestling Champion" badge that the current overall leader would get to wear. Ya know, it get's passed around depending on who has the best record? That would be neat.
Not a problem. I'll ask Umbrae to create a new award for it.

- I'll post the card the Sat before the event (Though maybe Friday would work better, whichever you guys wanna do)
Probably Friday just to give us a bigger window to work with.

Finally, I had a couple of special ideas I wanted to throw out there:

- Matches like The Royal Rumble match, and it's 30(+) entrants will be stacked against us in terms of probability. So what if correctly guessing the winner of the Royal Rumble match counted as say 5? Incorrect guesses would still be -1.

- What if correctly guessing EVERY match on a given card carried 1 bonus point with it?

- When The Elimination Chamber comes up, (or a similar elimination based affair) what if you gained a bonus point for every person you correctly guessed the order they would be eliminated? You list the order in which you think they are getting eliminated and for every one that falls in the correct spot you get a point. You don't have to get the ones before or after to get the bonus point. 1 point per correct guess. *I figure something like that could be optional. You don't have to them, you don't get knocked for not doing it, but it's a great opportunity to gain some ground.
I have no objections to any of this.

- Did you want to do TNA Wrestling as well? I know Brian (May) still watch them. I don't, but Shin and if Umberhulk joins in too and you all want to I will do that to and give it my best.
If you want to. Keeping track of WWE's Pay-Per-Views and TNA's Pay-Per-Views sounds like a lot of effort, but if you don't mind, then I say go for it.

The best part is that even though I'm probably the only one here who still follows the trainwreck that is TNA, I won't have an unfair advantage over you guys or anything. You can just make random guesses on every TNA Pay-Per-View and you'd probably be about as accurate as me. Gotta love TNA booking.

[ChukoLiang]

A contest? A free to participate contest? And a reward that only exists as bragging rights that can be easily lost the next month?


Shit, man, count me in.

I gotta ask, how will point system work? Like, is it one point, flat, for every correctly predicted match? Or would there be, like, bonus credit if it was like "X beats Y, with submission" or something?

Just asking. Worth knowing!

[AlucardsFate]

Oh? PSM wants in too? Cool! I didn't know you watched your wrasslin.

Shin doesn't seem too keen on the idea of doing TNA stuff. But for the sake of making this easy let's start with just the WWE stuff and go from there. Not try to eat the whole steak at once eh? Learn to walk first.

I gotta ask, how will point system work? Like, is it one point, flat, for every correctly predicted match? Or would there be, like, bonus credit if it was like "X beats Y, with submission" or something?

Yeah you get one point for every correctly predicted match. And one incorrect point for every wrong guess or match you don't guess. (Remember you have to have a prediction for EVERY match on a listed card, kinda so everyone has an even amount of opportunity) Your record will be listed like a traditional Win/Loss record. (Ex. 4-5 = 4 correct five incorrect) There are bonus credits for special match types as I mentioned, like the 30-Man Royal Rumble match. (Or are they doing 30+ again?) And we can totally do others as these matches come up later on. (And if you have any ideas for something like that feel free to say so we can all decide on it.)

Make sense?

Mrf. Okay, but if we aren't still predicting Pay-Per-Views by this time next year, I reserve the right to quote this post and say "I told you so."

Fair enough. Challenge accepted. I have the help of Rainlander to remind me of things. It will be cool to have a way to make this thread more active/interesting.

Anyone else have any input/questions/feedback regarding the little mini-rulebook I posted?

[escape_shoplift]

I'm in. I usually watch wrestling every week for some reason.

[ShinNatsume]

Start with the TLC card then?

[AlucardsFate]

I'm in. I usually watch wrestling every week for some reason.

Oh wow...hey what's up man? You came outta NOWHERE!

So if I have this right, those participating (So Far) will be:

AlucardsFate (myself)
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift
ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez

I actually didn't expect so much participation. Great!

Start with the TLC card then?

Yup, we will start a week from today for the TLC card.

[ShinNatsume]

Let's add a point if you can guess how low the PPV buyrate is going to be compared to last year. ;D

[AlucardsFate]

Um...does anyone actually track that information? I know I don't...

[ShinNatsume]

It was a joke, I'm just taking a shot at WWE's failure... big failure.

[ShinNatsume]

Everyone forgot about this? Well here is the card, bold = my picks

TLC WWE Title
CM Punk Vs Alberto Del Rio Vs The Miz

Chair Match World Heavyweight Championship
Mark Henry Vs Big Show

Sledgehammer Ladder Match (Two out of three quad tearing match)
Triple H Vs Kevin Nash

Intercontinental Championship
Cody Rhodes Vs Booker T

United States Championship
Dolph Ziggler Vs Zack Ryder

Tables Match
Randy Orton Vs Wade Barrett

[AlucardsFate]

No I just wasn't going to post till sometime tonight after Smackdown is over...over here. (I'm on fancy mountain man time over here.)

[SnakeEyez]

Everyone forgot about this?
I didn't. I was waiting for Alucard to post something first since this is his project and it's only polite to wait for him to get us started.

Anyway...

WWE Championship Triple Threat TLC Match: CM Punk (c) vs. The Miz vs. Alberto Del Rio
I'm gonna stick with the Punker to retain, but I'll be happy if Miz wins. This should be a really good match either way.
Winner: CM Punk

World Heavyweight Championship Chairs Match: Mark Henry (c) vs. Big Show
I'm really not sure about this one. I thought that maybe the WWE was building toward a David vs. Goliath match at Wrestlemania between Mark Henry and Daniel Bryan, but it occurs to be that they can do pretty much the same thing with Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan. The return of Kane threw a monkey wrench in the works. I can see Kane costing Henry the title, setting up a Kane vs. Henry feud that culminates at 'Mania. That would leave Big Show with the title as Bryan (hopefully) starts working his way toward the title match at Wrestlemania. Who knows. Common sense says to just stick with Henry, but I'm gonna go out on a limb here and pick Big Show. Hey, why not?
Winner: Big Show

Triple H vs. Kevin Nash (Sledgehammer Ladder Match)
Triple H. Don't care. Next.
Winner: Triple H

Cody Rhodes vs. Booker T
I would hope that Booker T realizes he's at that point in his career where it's time to start putting over the next generation of wrestlers, but after hearing about his antics in TNA when he was still over there, I'm not so sure. I'll go with Cody, but I'm far from positive.
Winner: Cody Rhodes

United States Championship: Dolph Ziggler (c) vs. Zack Ryder
I love this rivalry. I can't remember the last time we had a feud that actually made the US Title seem like such a big deal. Mr. Ziggles has been a great champion these past few months, but I think it's time for him to move on to bigger and better things. (I mentioned recently that I hope we get to see Punk vs. Ziggler for the WWE Title at Wrestlemania, and until I'm proven otherwise, I'm going to keep that scenario alive.) I say Dolph drops the US Title to a very deserving Ryder and starts his ascent to the main event.
Winner: Zack Ryder

Tables Match: Randy Orton vs. Wade Barrett
My kneejerk reaction is "Randy Orton lose a PPV match? Surely you jest." Then again, since this is a Tables match, it's not inconceivable for Orton to slip up and get sent through a table without looking weak in the process. (See John Cena vs. Sheamus from two years ago.) Still, I think Orton is a safe bet for this one. Won't be surprised if Barrett wins, though.
Winner: Randy Orton

[AlucardsFate]

I was gonna post the match list and all that jazz but you all beat me to it. Glad that everyone is excited!

Zack Ryder vs Dolph Ziggler (United States Championship)
I think this one is pretty cut and dry. Zack is going up here. He's been chasing Ziggles for awhile now and he's caught him.
Winner: Zack Ryder

Cody Rhodes vs Booker T (Intercontinental Championship)
It will be a fun match to see most definitely, but I don't think Booker is rolling up to topple Cody just yet. And I'm also a bit biased since I am a fan of Cody.
Winner: Cody Rhodes

Randy Orton vs Wade Barrett (Tables Match)
This one is a bit of a toughie. They like to have Orton win even in the most illogical of scenarios. Kind of a toss up, but I'm going to go with Barrett. I don't think they are making Wade look good up to now just to piss it away.
Winner: Wade Barrett

Big Show vs Mark Henry (Chairs Match, World Heavyweight Championship)
Mark Henry. Not only am I going to pick Henry. I'm going to tell you it's going to be Kane that wins it for him. I see Kane messing up both of them but I don't think he wants anyone to topple Henry except for him.
Winner: Mark Henry.

Kevin Nash vs Triple H (Sledgehammer Ladder Match)
This match to me is silly in concept. Doesn't Trips produce a sledgehammer from under the ring at will anyway? Well whatever, I figure this is just a fluff match anyway and Trips is gonna win it.
Winner: Triple H

The Miz vs Alberto Del Rio vs CM Punk (WWE Championship)
Punk ain't losin yet.
Winner: CM Punk

When does this start 8 Eastern time? Then I figure you will be allowed to make/change your picks up until 1 hour before that. So 7eastern time is the deadline. Agreed?

Also, I was going to watch this show, but a day late (And miss Raw) so if it's okay I'd rather not spoil the results for myself and would post the standings VERY late Mon night. If you'd really rather I do it straight away I'll just spoil it and do it after the show I will. It isn't a huge deal either way. Opinions?

[ChukoLiang]

Zack Ryder, because Ziggler's name is silly.

Cody Rhodes, because GodDAMN, how old is Booker T now?

Randy Orton, because I dunno who either of them are.

Big Show, because in wrestling the taller you are the better your odds become despite age. Just ask Kevin Nash!

Triple H: I'd go Nash, but I mean, I don't think he can even STAND at this point.

The final match is hard to predict, but I have to say the Miz, solely because he has terrifying facial expressions and the hate of little girls on his side. I think he is secretly a dark evil magic user and runs off the hate and rage of little girls.

[ShinNatsume]

You see I'm probably going to be wrong, but I chose Ziggler in my match simply because it was be stupid to give Ryder the belt now, no one watches TLC, if they do it at Royal Rumble or Wrestlemania it will be a huge deal. I don't know what logical reason they could have but to piss it away at a silly gimmick PPV with a poor buy rate. =/

MAKE FEUDS MATTER. >:l

[AlucardsFate]

I figure they are getting ready to push Ziggler. (Though I don't think he's ready for such a thing, he's still relying on Vickie for heat) But I just think it's looking that way.

Remember! Since I will be watching this a day late, (sometime tomorrow night) I will be posting results late Mon night. (And missing Raw until Sat) Watching with others who aren't available until then.

[ShinNatsume]

My boy D-BRYAN!

[AlucardsFate]

One day I'd like to see someone fail at MITB. They should have had it fail and then he wins the Royal Rumble. Woulda been more meaningful I think. But that was a pretty decent PPV for once, NO CENA. So it qualifies as decent.

Anyway! RESULTS! I figure I'll color code everyone, Green for Correct, Red for incorrect. (And I'll blue the match winners) There were a couple matches I didn't see on the official card on TLC's website and one that got added midshow, it looks like you guys didn't know about them either so I'll just zero em. (Like anyone cares about Kelly Kelly anyway)

WWE United States Championship
Dolph Ziggler (c) vs. Zack Ryder

I thought this one was fairly obvious myself. It was still fun to watch, it wasn't bad. I'm just glad that Ziggler doesn't have the title to make meaningless anymore. He just always kinda...had it, never really did anything with it.

ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)

WWE Tag Team Championships
Kofi Kingston and Evan Bourne (c's) vs. Epico and Primo w/ Rosa Mendes

Zero for everyone! Unlisted match! I will say that Rosa was the most entertaining part of this match...just kinda...moving around out there...wha?

Tables Match
Randy Orton vs. Wade Barrett
God I find Orton boring. He even managed to do the same ol crap in a special match. He even did the "mid air RKO" finish...AGAIN. Ugh...Unfortunately I bet against them doing the stale thing because I like Barrett.

ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)

WWE Divas Championship
Beth Phoenix (c) vs. Kelly Kelly

Another zero. Ugly match. Fans didn't care. Whatever.

Sledgehammer Ladder Match
Triple H vs. Kevin Nash

This actually started out okay. Then Nash's knees caught up with him and he was just kinda stumbling around. And ol Trips hasn't worked out in awhile. It shows. One hilarious thing though, a "Vinnie Vegas" chant broke out TWICE during the match.

ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)

Sheamus vs. Jack Swagger

Why are we wasting time on this sudden match? Zero.

WWE World Heavyweight Championship - Chairs Match
Mark Henry (c) vs. The Big Show

Wow I called this one way off the mark. Maybe because I was enjoying Mark Henry as champ. (As strange as that is) And it sucks worse then the last one.


ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)

WWE World Heavyweight Championship - Chairs Match
The Big Show (c) vs Daniel Bryan

That damn breifcase. This obviously doesn't count, but I wonder if we shouldn't add a bonus if you manage to call a MITB cash in...THAT would be impressive.

WWE Intercontinental Championship
Cody Rhodes (c) vs. Booker T

This one was pretty good. And I was happy to see the IC match at the back end of the show. That was most welcome. Cody's title reign means something. The match itself was pretty decent. Booker was Booker and Cody played off of him pretty well. I have a feeling this isn't over though.

ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)

WWE Championship - TLC Match
CM Punk (c) vs. The Miz vs. Alberto Del Rio

The last one was good, this one was better. They threw all sorts of craziness around, mostly at Punk and it was entertaining throughout. Even Michael wasn't SUPER annoying during it.

ShinNatsume
SnakeEyez
AlucardsFate
ChukoLiang
escaped_shoplift (No pick)[/B]

TLC Results:
ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 6-0
AlucardsFate: 4-2
ChukoLiang: 5-1 (Whatever bizarre logic you're using is working for you somehow)
escaped_shoplift: 0-6

Total Results: (Champion in Gold)
ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 6-0 (Congrats to Brian for the clean sweep!)
AlucardsFate: 4-2
ChukoLiang: 5-1 (Whatever bizarre logic you're using is working for you somehow)
escaped_shoplift: 0-6

So Bri if you have that champion badge ready...it's all yours isn't it... It's still close though!

[SnakeEyez]

You missed one (Mark Henry vs. Big Show, it would seem). We predicted the outcomes of six matches, so those scores should be out of six, not out of five.

[AlucardsFate]

Heh. Whoops. Corrected. Once I get used to these things ya know? Forgot to throw the result part of that one in.

[ChukoLiang]

Awesome.

Temporary silver. I can only barely wait to take the lead next PPV.

I guess I shouldn't have relied on the hate power...

[ShinNatsume]

Disappointment they gave Ryder the strap so soon, eh I should stop estimating from a logical standpoint and try and think like the WWE creative. Perhaps I should hit my head off a tree before I do these? >_>

Congrats to the champ', looking forward to more of these.

[SnakeEyez]

Fresh out of the oven, here is the shiny Foxkei Champion award. Take it from me if you can!

5674

[AlucardsFate]

Disappointment they gave Ryder the strap so soon, eh I should stop estimating from a logical standpoint and try and think like the WWE creative. Perhaps I should hit my head off a tree before I do these? >_>

Congrats to the champ', looking forward to more of these.

I thought that they had him chase it pretty good. Ziggler was boring with it anyway.

Fresh out of the oven, here is the shiny Foxkei Champion award. Take it from me if you can!

5674

Gotta figure out how to get him into some kind of handicap match and take it...yes...that's it.

[ShinNatsume]

How much bigger would it be for Zack Ryder to win it at WRESTLEMANIA though? Just saying the pay off would of been huge. We never get the boyhood dream come true. Sure it's a mid card title, but it would of made that title feel so much more important.

What happens now? Ryder defends again Ziggler at the Rumble? Then Jack Swagger? Then who? There is no one else in the division that's going to make a huge mid title feud that makes the belt look important. WWE let something slip right through there fingers there and unless it's to push Ziggler to a world title by Mania, then in my opinion they fucked up.

[AlucardsFate]

So Randy Orton is hurt for roughly 6 months. It may sound morbid, but this is great! It opens up a spot for some younger talent, gives assurance that they won't do to Daniel Bryan what they did to Christian and it more then anything, gives Wade Barrett a massive rub for being the guy that knocked him off.

Wonderful.

[ShinNatsume]

Probably end up moving CM Punk to the Smackdown brand...

[SnakeEyez]

As 2011 comes to a close, it's time to look back on the past year of pro wrestling and recognize both the good and the bad. Like my post from last year (http://foxkei.com/forums/showpost.php?p=82938&postcount=35), I'm going to talk about some of the best and the worst moments of the year from 2011. If you want to do the same, go right ahead.

I pulled the categories from the Wrestling Observer Newsletter's yearly awards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Wrestling_Observer_Newsletter_awards) and altered a few of them just to make things more manageable. Do keep in mind that I only follow WWE and TNA, so all of these awards focus on just those two organizations.

Best Feud/Rivalry of the Year
Worst Feud/Rivalry of the Year
Tag Team of the Year
Most Improved Wrestler
Best Promos/Interviews
Most Overrated
Most Underrated
Best Non-Wrestler Personality
Best Wrestling Announcer
Worst Wrestling Announcer
Best Wrestling Move
Female Wrestler of the Year
Male Wrestler of the Year
Match of the Year

My choices are...

Best Feud/Rivalry of the Year: Dolph Ziggler vs. Zack Ryder
Runner-up: Randy Orton vs. Christian
Even though it was never the main focus of the show, I loved the rivalry between Dolph Ziggler and Zack Ryder. These two feuded over the US Title off-and-on for the better part of four months, but what you saw on TV was only half the story. The other half took place on Zack Ryder's weekly YouTube show, "Z! True Long Island Story," which I have been following almost since the beginning. It was a great straightforward story of a rising star trying to live his dream and complete the Cinderella story -- only to be stopped repeatedly by the cocky sleazebag who talked a big game and backed it up in the ring. Ziggler and Ryder have great chemistry and they work well together both inside and outside the ring. I chose Orton vs. Christian as the runner-up because it really gave Christian a chance to shine after all his hard work in the company over the years. His constant whining and demands for "one more match" were spot-on. It got annoying after a while, but that was the point. It also didn't hurt that he and Orton had a good series of matches in the process.

Worst Feud/Rivalry of the Year: Michael Cole vs. Jerry Lawler
Runner-up: Sin Cara Azul vs. Sin Cara Negro
The whole Cole vs. Lawler rivalry was just unbearable. The only reason you have a feud like this is so the annoying rat-like heel (that would be Cole) talks himself into a fight he can't win and gets his comeuppance in the end. Well, that didn't happen. Cole and Lawler fought a series of matches (sometimes involving Swagger and Jim Ross) and Cole managed to come out on top in almost all of them. This feud eventually "ended" but nothing was resolved. Cole and Lawler go back to the commentary both and Cole continues to be just as obnoxious and unbearable as ever. So then what was the point of this whole thing? Just to shove even more Michael Cole bullshit down our throats? That's the only thing I got out of it. For the runner-up, I went with Sin Cara vs. Sin Cara. There's nothing quite as entertaining as pitting two recently-debuting identical masked wrestlers against each other before the fans can determine who is who or why they're feuding in the first place, right?

Tag Team of the Year: Beer Money, Inc. (James Storm & Robert Roode)
Runner-up: The Awesome Truth (Miz & R-Truth)
Some slim pickings in the tag team division this year, but I went with one of the best ideas that TNA has ever had, Beer Money. Before they split up around Bound for Glory, Roode and Storm dominated the tag team division in TNA. In fact, their tag team title reign this year was the longest TNA Tag Team Championship reign in the company's history. That's pretty impressive. Better yet, even after they split up, they both seem to be doing pretty well for themselves (Roode is the TNA Champion and James Storm is in a main event level feud with Kurt Angle). Not too shabby for a couple guys who were thrown together a couple years ago because TNA didn't know what to do with them as singles wrestlers. Miz and R-Truth claim the runner-up spot for best tag team. Though they didn't team together for very long (three months, if that), they definitely made an impact. They were one of the main reasons why Triple H was removed from his COO position, they defeated Triple H and CM Punk in a tag match at Vengeance, and they were even in the main event of Survivor Series against Rock and Cena.

Most Improved Wrestler: Zack Ryder
Runner-up: Mark Henry
When I say "Most Improved," I mean it in a more general sense -- biggest overall improvement from where they were a year ago. In that sense, no one else on the WWE or TNA roster has improved more than Zack Ryder. At this time last year, he was a waste-of-space jabroni who was undoubtedly going to be future endeavored. One successful YouTube show and a whole lot of fan support later, Zack Ryder is one of the most popular wrestlers in the WWE today. His rise to success is a great Cinderella story: he's just an ordinary guy living his dream, and the fans have an easy time connecting to that. The runner-up here is Mark Henry for finally breaking through that glass ceiling and enjoying a respectable reign as World Heavyweight Champion. His promo work has been great this year, and WWE did a great job of booking him to look like a monster and an unstoppable destructive force.

Best Promos/Interviews: CM Punk
Runner-up: Bully Ray
Do I really need to explain why CM Punk won this category? The so-called "Summer of Punk" was filled to the brim with fantastic promos from The Second-City Saint. Every time there was a microphone near Punk's mouth, magic happened. Bully Ray gets a nod as runner-up for being one of the most obnoxious human beings to ever walk the planet. When he's on the microphone, he plays his role perfectly -- talking a whole lot of smack to rile up his opponents, then ducking behind a line of security or behind a few of his Immortal goons just so he can keep talking smack while staying out of reach. Every time Bully Ray yammers on in his obnoxious nasally voice, you just can't help but feel the urge to smack him in the face.

Most Overrated: Hulk Hogan
Runner-up: Sin Cara
There were so very many people to choose from in this category, but I eventually decided on Hulk Hogan with Sin Cara as the runner-up. Hulk Hogan takes home this dishonor for turning TNA Impact into The Hulk Hogan Show for the better part of 10 months (he had the courtesy to step out of the limelight in October after Bound for Glory). Every single week, Hogan would be featured prominently in at least three or four different segments throughout the night. In all of them, he would cut the exact same promo again and again and do his best to make himself relevant in a company that never needed him in the first place. Trailing behind Hogan was The Human Botchamania Reel himself, Sin Cara. I'm sure his downfall wasn't entirely his fault since he was trying to wrestle an unfamiliar style in an unfamiliar country in front of an unfamiliar audience, but that doesn't excuse the fact that WWE pushed him to the moon anyway. He messed up his moves consistently in every match (even against competent wrestlers like Primo and Chavo Guerrero), had a terrible feud with Hunico/Sin Cara Negro (see above), and somehow managed to injure himself by performing one single not-especially-dangerous move at Survivor Series. Cripes.

Like I said, there were a lot of contenders for this award, so dishonorable mentions go to Crimson for being pushed as an undefeated monster even though he's only "meh" in the ring and is as charismatic as a tube sock, Alicia Fox for somehow continuing to win matches despite being as coordinated and graceful as a newborn giraffe, Jeff Hardy for somehow remaining an active wrestler in TNA even though he completely embarrassed the company at Victory Road, Mr. Anderson for having two reigns as TNA World Champion this year despite looking completely bored and unmotivated in the ring, and Ezekiel Jackson for getting a reign as Intercontinental Champion simply for being Large Muscular Man #1,872.

Most Underrated: Jay Lethal
Runner-up: Generation Me
Poor Jay Lethal. He went from being one of the fastest-rising stars in TNA and an almost guaranteed future TNA Champion to being...well, released from the company since creative had nothing for him. What on earth were they thinking? Lethal is talented in the ring, he has charisma and can connect to the fans, he's very entertaining (just see his feud with Ric Flair from last year for proof), he's pretty good on the microphone, and he still has many more years left in his career since he's still a young guy. If I was TNA, I'd be doing everything in my power to keep a guy like that on the roster. And speaking of releasing talented stars, why would they let Generation Me go so easily? Gen Me is a ridiculously talented tag team that could have been permanent staples of either the X-Division or the tag team division. I've had the pleasure of seeing them perform live when they took on the Motor City Machine Guns at Bound for Glory 2010, and some of the things they do in the ring are just unbelievable. Shame on you, TNA, for letting Jay Lethal and Generation Me slip through the cracks.

Best Non-Wrestler Personality: Vickie Guerrero
Runner-up: Ricardo Rodriguez
Vickie Guerrero continues her legacy as one of the best heel managers of all time. All it takes is one well-placed "Excuse Me!" (or three or four) to send the crowd into a frenzy of boos. She's done a great job helping Dolph Ziggler (and, to a lesser extent, Jack Swagger) establish themselves throughout the past year. Mr. Rodriguez gets a nod as runner-up for being a great stooge for Del Rio. He's one of the funniest guys in the WWE aside from Santino, and there's always just something bizarrely entertaining about seeing him get clobbered by whoever happens to be feuding with Alberto Del Rio at the time.

Best Wrestling Announcer: Josh Matthews
Runner-up: Scott Stanford
Josh Matthews continues his steady rise as the WWE's next great announcer. Most of the time, he's the anchor point of the announce team who tries to connect the over-the-top personalities of Michael Cole, Booker T, and Jerry Lawler. He calls the matches, he puts over the talent in the ring, and he shows some humor and personality without taking it overboard. Matthews is the perfect announcer right now. Runner-up is Scott Stanford for doing...pretty much the exact same thing that Matthews is doing. He calls the action and shows his personality every now and then, and he gets the job done well. Plus, he's been highly entertaining on "Z! True Long Island Story" over the past year.

Worst Wrestling Announcer: Michael Cole
Runner-up: Booker T
If you've watched WWE programming at any point over the past year, I'm sure you know why I picked these two. I've already talked about Michael Cole way too much for my liking, so I'm just going to leave it at that.

Best Wrestling Move: Brogue Kick (Sheamus)
Runner-up: Chaos Theory (Douglas Williams)
Is it just me, or does Sheamus' Brogue Kick look nastier and nastier every week? Christ on a cracker, he just kills guys with that move. Douglas Williams gets the runner-up spot here because his Chaos Theory rolling German suplex looks damn impressive every single time I see it. (It's just a shame that I never get to see it these days since he's hardly ever on TV.)

Female Wrestler of the Year: Beth Phoenix
Runner-up: Mickie James
Slim pickings in this category as well. I would have liked to pick Kharma for being the most interesting thing to happen to the WWE women's division since the Mickie James-Trish Stratus feud, but then she had to go and get preggers before she even had a chance to wrestle. The backup choice would have to be Beth Phoenix since she's one of the few remaining women on the WWE roster who actually knows how to wrestle (although you'd never know it since the ladies of WWE are only given about 30 to 60 seconds per match). Mickie James gets the runner-up spot for being the most consistently featured gal in the TNA women's division throughout the year.

Male Wrestler of the Year: CM Punk
Runner-up: Randy Orton
This has definitely been CM Punk's year. In the first half of the year, he was busy being his usual awesome self -- feuding with Randy Orton, helping a couple new guys in the New Nexus get over, the usual. Then Money in the Bank started approaching and things got interesting. Really interesting. For the first time in a long time, wrestling fans like us were on the edges of our seats and giddy with anticipation to see what would happen next. We eagerly tuned in every week to watch the latest chapter unfold in the ongoing whirlwind that Punk was causing. Punk has been simply incredible since then, putting on great matches with guys like John Cena, Alberto Del Rio, Triple H, and The Miz. No one else can even come close. However, Randy Orton does come in at a distant second. He has definitely had an eventful year. In 2011 alone, he's had significant feuds with CM Punk, Christian, Sheamus, Mark Henry, Cody Rhodes, and Wade Barrett. I may not be Orton's biggest fan, but I will certainly recognize that he is a valuable asset to the company.

Match of the Year: John Cena vs. CM Punk (WWE Money in the Bank)
Runner-up: Austin Aries vs. Zema Ion vs. Jack Evans vs. Low Ki (TNA Destination X)
CM Punk vs. John Cena at Money in the Bank was an amazing match. It happened right at the height of Punk's popularity and it was even in Punk's hometown of Chicago. He was on his way out the door and was hell-bent on taking the WWE Title with him. Facing him was the rock-steady status quo of the WWE, John Cena. Though Cena's ring work is incredibly formulaic at times, he can and does turn things up a notch when the situation demands -- and this was one such situation. Cena ditched his formulaic approach and pulled out a few new moves we've never seen from him before. Punk did likewise and really took the fight to Cena. This match was given plenty of time to unfold, both combatants told an excellent story in this ring, and the crowd was absolutely electric from beginning to end. It stands head-and-shoulders above every other match I've seen this year. The runner-up spot goes to an entertaining and fast-paced match from TNA Destination X. These four athletes put on an excellent show that really captured the essence of the X-Division. There was plenty of action, but they paced it really well so it didn't become a "spotfest." I loved it.


...that ended up being much longer than I was expecting it to be.

[UmberHulk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0fcDmbX3aU&feature=player_embedded

lol

[AlucardsFate]

Ugh...Brodus Clay makes my entire brain hate life....forever. Even more because he's using Earnest "The Cat" Miller's WWE theme song. (Fun fact) And I had to remember that "The Cat" existed as a result...

Anyway, two weeks out until The Royal Rumble kids! Remember to save the date. (or five minutes that day for a forum post) Also remember that picking the winner of the Royal Rumble match correctly (A 1/30 shot) is worth 5 so get thinking!

[UmberHulk]

Some call his momma!

hahaahahaha jericho

[AlucardsFate]

Sorry kids, I was out of the house for all of yesterday. (including most of the night) Anyway, since it's the Royal Rumble, it's fairly light on matches to make room for the big one.

John Cena vs Kane
I don't usually pick against Cena because they like to make the kids happy, but to make Kane's return mean even 1% of anything...HE HAS TO WIN THIS. I don't care if he cheats, hits him with a car, whatever. He has to win.

Daniel Bryan vs Mark Henry vs The Big Show
Seem like kind of a crazy call? Well he's the only one who can climb the cage right? I think he can weasel his way out of one more but in a really obvious way to complete his heel spin.

CM Punk vs Dolph Ziggler (W/ John Laurinaitis as Referee)
I just don't see Ziggler as champion yet, especially not heading into the biggest time of the year. Even with ol Johnny Ace in control.

30 Man Royal Rumble Match: (remember, this is five if you get it right!)
Chris Jericho. I had a few in mind, but I have to go with my old buddy Y2J. I think he's going to hang outside and troll everyone forever until the last man...then he's going to win the match. Jerry Lawler almost won this way once, he hid under the ring until the end of the match.

[ChukoLiang]

Where can I see the list of people in the royal rumble?

[SnakeEyez]

Where can I see the list of people in the royal rumble?

You can't. Usually WWE releases a list of Rumble participants ahead of time, but for whatever reason, they just haven't done it this year.

Off the top of my head, here are a few of the people I know will be in the Rumble just because they've been mentioned on TV as participants over the past few weeks.

Definitely:
Chris Jericho, Cody Rhodes, Sheamus, Wade Barrett, Jinder Mahal, Jack Swagger, Mick Foley, Brodus Clay, Santino Marella, The Miz, R-Truth

Maybe:
John Cena, Kane, Randy Orton, Alberto Del Rio, David Otunga, Hornswoggle, Heath Slater, Justin Gabriel, Ezekiel Jackson, Kofi Kingston, Mason Ryan


Predictions:

John Cena vs. Kane
Usually not a good idea to bet against Cena, especially when he enters Super Serious Mode. His buddy Ryder got chokeslammed to hell, so now it's time for Super Cena to swoop into battle and get his revenge against the villainous Kane -- but only after succumbing to his anger and embracing the hate just like Kane wants him to. Step #1 of Cena's fall from grace as he heads toward his showdown with The Rock.

World Heavyweight Championship: Daniel Bryan (c) vs. Mark Henry vs. The Big Show (Steel Cage Match)
This rivalry has been much more interesting over the past few weeks than I thought it would be. Bryan has been great as a heel so far, and Big Show and Henry are both playing their respective roles really well. I think Bryan finds a way to weasel his way out of this one by escaping the cage while Big Show and Henry destroy each other.

WWE Championship: CM Punk (c) vs. Dolph Ziggler (w/ John Laurinaitis as Referee)
Well, I said a couple weeks ago that I was hoping to see this match at Wrestlemania, so either way, I'm expecting these two to put on a Wrestlemania-quality match. At the end of it all...I'm gonna say Punk. Johnny No-Charisma (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v512/SnakeEyez8/JohnnyFace.jpg) might try to pull some shenanigans, but I think Punk finds a way to win anyway.

30-Man Royal Rumble Match:
Really tough to predict this one since the WWE isn't giving us a list like they always do. Part of me wants to stick to my guns and say Ziggler enters the Rumble after losing to Punk, wins it, then heads to 'Mania to get another shot...but I'm just not sure that the WWE wants to go that route. Jericho seems like a pretty safe pick since Punk vs. Jericho at 'Mania is another good possibility. I'll play it safe and say Chris Jericho wins the Rumble. If Ziggler wins, though, I am going to kick myself so hard.

[AlucardsFate]

But Kane just has to win. He has to. Otherwise there has been no point to any of this.

[AlucardsFate]

Results: (Winners in bold)
Daniel Bryan vs Mark Henry vs The Big Show
Unremarkable cage match, though for a second I REALLY though Show was gonna pull him back up with one hand.

(Unlisted) Beth Phoenix, Natalya and The Bella Twins vs. Kelly Kelly, Eve, Alicia Fox and Tamina
Ugh...At least the Alicia Fox exposure was kept to a minimum. And at least Beth's face ain't busted anymore.

John Cena vs Kane
Double Countout. Well I suppose it's better then me losing but still kinda lame.

CM Punk vs Dolph Ziggler (W/ John Laurinaitis as Referee)
Ziggler got murdered pretty handily here. But it showed off his only real outstanding skill. The man can sell. Everything else? Not as much.

(Unlisted)Brodus Clay vs. Drew McIntyre
Why was this match even here?

30 Man Royal Rumble Match:
Winner: Sheamus
That is a genuine shock. What was the point of Jericho's End of the World thing now? And why Sheamus, though I suppose he's a guy who does need the credibility bump in recent days. Maybe they didn't want a huge title match for Wrestlemania since Rock/Cena is gonna wear the crowd out.

Royal Rumble: The Double Countout is nulled, and that really leaves only two eligable matches, what with all the unannounced crap.

AlucardsFate: 2-0
SnakeEyez: 2-0

*Before the total, I have a question. It retrospect it seems silly to subtract numbers for non-participation. I mean they are already sporting a huge 0 while we still add numbers on. (And it is disintegrating any chance to catch up) This is still an evolving science after all. I'd like input on that before we get too far in so I can still rekajigger the math while I can. (You'll notice I haven't subtracted down below just yet)

Total:
ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 8-0 (Curse you!)
AlucardsFate: 6-2
ChukoLiang: 5-1
escaped_shoplift: 0-6

[ChukoLiang]

I am against SUBTRACTING numbers, since I had the joy of constant computer switching in the past three (?) days, and as such have unfortunately had a bit more things to do (install antiviruses, update shit, get NEW shit, make sure shit works) than I typically would and like a fucking idiot forgot about this and a big goose egg right there is pretty harsh punishment already.

I mean we end up with only four or five points possible per event because of how much is announced ahead of time anyway, right? So for example to be leading after the next, assuming four possible points, SE would have to get zero points, and alucards only 2 for me to be LEADING.

Considering record so far, that seems pretty hard to catch up on already. Don't need NEGATIVES on top of that.

especially since I was totally in second last time...at least I wouldn't have gotten anything anyway with what I was GOING to pick (big show, ziggler and I forgot my royal rumble pick already)

[SnakeEyez]

Yeah, it's fine the way it is. I don't think we need to subtract points. If you don't make predictions, you're already at enough of a disadvantage to those who do (unless the folks who make predictions get all of them wrong somehow).

-----------------------------------------------------------

If you're not one of the cool kids who has been following Zack Ryder's YouTube show over the past year, here's your chance to get caught up. Episode #51 is the obligatory recap episode.

5OQiMfmLCQ0

[AlucardsFate]

*First, the corrected totals:
ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 8-0 (Curse you!)
AlucardsFate: 6-2
ChukoLiang: 5-1
escaped_shoplift: 0-6
Ya know I almost forgot! The Elimination Chamger is such a waste of space PPV and all. Honestly I think they shouldn't have a PPV show in between the Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania. But that's just me. But here is the card as listed:

Divas Championship:
Beth Phoenix vs. Tamina Snuka
I see they are giving her daddy's last name now. But I don't see her winning, there is nowhere to go so close to WM with that. Which is the inherent problem with this PPV in general. It's too close to do anything substantial into the next show. Winner: Beth Phoenix

Ambulance Match:
John Cena vs Kane
Huh? Nope still think Ambulance matches are stupid. BUT KANE HAS TO WIN FOR ME. Please for me! He won't...Cena will go into some super rage and "Turn to the darkside" I figure. Making this one big colossal waste of everyone's time. (Kinda a theme here) Winner: John Cena

Smackdown Elimination Chamber (World Heavyweight Championship):
The Great Kahli vs The Big Show vs Santino Marella vs Cody Rhodes vs Wade Barrett vs Daniel Bryan:
Is Santino really in this? For some reason I love that about this match. He won't win of course, but I hope they let him eliminate someone. That would be something. But a lot of guys in here have credit to lose. So I need Santino to eliminate The Great Kahli in some spectacular way. That would be great. Anyway, if you had asked me last week, I would have said that "The WWE loves to feel up Orton so much that he was going to win this" but I think that him getting hurt is only a good thing. (I know how that sounds, I stick by it) and I think they have nothing to do here but have Bryan retain. Especially with the massive amount of heat he's been getting week to week. Kinda a testament to how good he is, he's taking the crumb they gave him and baked a cake. A pretty cake. He followed the cooking by the book. He knew he couldn't be lazy. Winner: Daniel Bryan

Raw Elimination Chamber (WWE Championship):
Kofi Kingston vs Chris Jericho vs Dolph Ziggler vs The Miz vs R-Truth vs CM Punk:
Punk. Punk all the way. Again it's too close and they don't wanna spoil what could be a special Punk/Jericho match at WM do they? I hope not. Though they have been pushing Kofi a bit for the past week or so, so I expect him to go over on somebody, he ain't winning the match. Winner: CM Punk.

Sorry I was a mite late. You have until I suppose before it starts tomorrow night. I figure I'll be "watching" it a day late. So I will be late there for sure.

[ChukoLiang]

*First, the corrected totals:
ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 8-0 (Curse you!)
AlucardsFate: 6-2
ChukoLiang: 5-1
escaped_shoplift: 0-6
Ya know I almost forgot! The Elimination Chamger is such a waste of space PPV and all. Honestly I think they shouldn't have a PPV show in between the Royal Rumble and Wrestlemania. But that's just me. But here is the card as listed:

Divas Championship:
Beth Phoenix vs. Tamina Snuka
I see they are giving her daddy's last name now. But I don't see her winning, there is nowhere to go so close to WM with that. Which is the inherent problem with this PPV in general. It's too close to do anything substantial into the next show. Winner: Beth Phoenix

Ambulance Match:
John Cena vs Kane
Smackdown Elimination Chamber (World Heavyweight Championship):
The Great Kahli vs The Big Show vs Santino Marella vs Cody Rhodes vs Wade Barrett vs Daniel Bryan:
[COLOR="Black"]Raw Elimination Chamber (WWE Championship):
Kofi Kingston vs Chris Jericho vs Dolph Ziggler vs The Miz vs R-Truth vs CM Punk:
[/B]

Sorry if I miss one, it's hard to filter out all the stuff you say without getting one of the matches out and I'm kind of rushed at the moment.

Kane, because he's a zombie, and zombies always win.

The Great Kahli, because the only name I know is big show, and he's fucking OOOOOOLD

The Miz, because heels.

Oh, nad phoenix. Because ashes

[SnakeEyez]

Divas Championship: Beth Phoenix (c) vs. Tamina Snuka
Beth Phoenix so she can (hopefully) look ahead to a showdown with Kharma at Wrestlemania.

Ambulance Match: John Cena vs. Kane
Yep, I think this is the match where John Cena snaps, "embraces the hate," and gets his revenge on Kane for all the stuff he's done over the past few weeks. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Kane wins this one because Cena is too much of a goody-two-shoes good guy to succumb to his anger. That might work if they plan to push him as the underdog against The Rock at 'Mania. Tough call. For now, I'll stick with the ol' "Never bet against Cena" mindset.

Smackdown Elimination Chamber (World Heavyweight Championship):
Daniel Bryan (c) vs. The Great Khali vs. The Big Show vs. Santino Marella vs. Cody Rhodes vs. Wade Barrett
These Chamber matches are really tough to predict because you have to think ahead to Wrestlemania. It looks like we're heading toward CM Punk vs. Chris Jericho for the WWE Title and Daniel Bryan vs. Big Show for the World Heavyweight Championship...but then where does that leave Sheamus? He's guaranteed to have a title shot at Wrestlemania, so he needs to be inserted into one of those matches. That means that if we do see CM Punk vs. Jericho and Bryan vs. Big Show, one of those matches won't be for the championship.

I was all ready to predict Orton as the winner of this match so we could see Orton vs. Sheamus at Wrestlemania (really the only reasonable "Sheamus vs. Somebody" possibility between the two Chamber matches) while Bryan and Big Show take care of their unfinished business without the championship getting in the way. Now that Orton is out of the match, that makes things a lot more complicated.

So, process of elimination. Great Khali sure as heck isn't winning. Who's he gonna defend the title against, Jinder Mahal? Santino Marella...no. No, it's just too crazy to even think about it. Probably not Cody Rhodes either. Cody vs. Goldust at Wrestlemania looks like it just might happen, so I doubt Cody is going to win the big one and headline 'Mania. Wade Barrett does have a reasonable chance since he and Sheamus have some history together and they might be able to get a Wrestlemania match out of that. Big Show isn't going to win it because then he would be the one to beat and Bryan would have to come after him at 'Mania. Big Show has been chasing Bryan for months, so it wouldn't make sense to suddenly switch the roles and have Bryan chase after Big Show. Bryan does have a good chance of retaining the title, which could lead to Bryan vs. Sheamus at Wrestlemania...but what about Big Show? Sure, we've heard the rumors that Big Show and Shaquille O'Neal are facing each other at 'Mania, but I'm lukewarm to the idea. Big Show and Daniel Bryan have a good thing going, and 'Mania would be the perfect place for Big Show to finally get his hands on the pipsqueak that has been bugging him for months on end and get some well-deserved retribution. Besides, Mark Henry would make a much better opponent for Shaq, don't you think?

So the only two reasonable choices right now are Daniel Bryan and Wade Barrett. Bryan definitely seems like the safe choice, but I'm going to go out on a limb and predict Wade Barrett. That way we can see CM Punk vs. Jericho, Daniel Bryan vs. Big Show, Wade Barrett vs. Sheamus, and Mark Henry vs. Shaquille O'Neal at Wrestlemania. Everybody is happy and nobody gets left out of the picture.

And for the record, I know I'm being foolish be predicting the Wrestlemania card that I want to see instead of predicting the card that I think the WWE is actually going to go with. There are just too many possibilities to consider here. If Orton was in this match or if Jericho had won the Royal Rumble instead of Sheamus, these Chamber matches would be so much easier to predict.

Raw Elimination Chamber (WWE Championship):
CM Punk (c) vs. Kofi Kingston vs. Chris Jericho vs. Dolph Ziggler vs. The Miz vs. R-Truth
Okay, I've rambled on long enough, so I'll keep this one short and sweet. Punk retains so he can do battle with Chris Jericho at Wrestlemania. However, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Jericho wins and Punk ends up chasing him for the belt at 'Mania. The other four guys are just here to highlight Punk and Jericho, I reckon.


-------------------------------------------------------------


And now, I present the best 20 minutes of your life.

kNneksa3lM8

[AlucardsFate]

Ya know I was expecting an ill timed blackout. Anyway, fast fast fast results from last month! A bit late. Brian finally got one wrong, the universe is fair...

ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 11-1
AlucardsFate: 10-2
ChukoLiang: 6-4
escaped_shoplift: 0-6

Wrestlemania is a kind of a loaded up card, lotsa numbers here:

Triple Threat Tag Team Match (WWE Tag Team Championships):
Primo & Epico vs The Usos vs Justin Gabriel & Tyson Kidd
Wow, this match totally doesn't matter. So I guess the champions will retain. Winner: Primo & Epico

Kelly Kelly & Maria Menounos vs. Beth Phoenix & Eve Torres
The celebrity guest always wins. Winner: Kelly Kelly & Maria Menounos.

Randy Orton vs Kane
The last minute match to make sure they both get a check? This one is just a crowd pleaser and the crowd likes Orton to do his same 3 moves and win. So... Winner: Randy Orton.

Team Teddy Long
Santino Marella, Booker T, The Great Kahli, R-Truth, Kofi Kingston and Zack Ryder
vs
Team John Laurinaitis
David Otunga, Jack Swagger, Drew McIntyre, Mark Henry, Dolph Ziggler and The Miz
The crowd just loves Santino right now but for the future of entertaining TV it would be better for Johnny to win. This one is a really tough one to call actually...But I figure they will go for the RIGHT NOW crowd reaction over a secure future of heels. Winner: Team Teddy Long

Big Show vs Cody Rhodes (Intercontinental Championship)
They are making a big deal about Show never winning at Wrestlemania. I think they are going to give him one. He's been here for awhile. As much as I'd rather see Cody win...all the time...forever. Winner: Big Show

Sheamus vs Daniel Bryan (World Heavyweight Championship)
I expect AJ to screw Bryan over here. At least Sheamus will finally have a purpose again, instead of being "That guy everyone has to fight to be punished." Winner: Sheamus

Triple H vs The Undertaker
Only a fool bets against Taker here. I think he wants to get to 20 before he retires. Winner: Undertaker

The Rock Vs John Cena
God I want Rocky to win but I just know that Cena is pulling this out. It's a pass the torch moment. Same as Hogan did for the Rock so many years back. Unfortunate. We should pass it to a wrestler. Winner: John Cena.

Chris Jericho vs CM Punk (WWE Championship)
I love both of these guys. But I have been in Jericho's camp for so much longer. Part of me just wants to roll with that. This is another really tough call. I just feel like that there isn't as many places to go with Jericho as champ in the future. I think it makes more logical sense for Punk to win. Either way this is the one I've been looking forward to the most. Even before Jericho came back this one has been a fantasy in my head. Winner: CM Punk.

[SnakeEyez]

Triple-Threat Tag Team Title Match: Primo & Epico (c) vs. The Usos vs. Justin Gabriel & Tyson Kidd
I actually really like the team of Primo and Epico (and Rosa), so I'm glad they made it onto the card.

Kelly Kelly & Maria Menounos vs. Beth Phoenix & Eve Torres
Why Is This Match Happening (WITMH)? But yeah, the celebrity guest never loses.

Randy Orton vs. Kane
WITMH?, Part 2. At least it's easy to predict. "Guy Who Hardly Ever Loses" vs. "Guy Who Excels In Putting Over the Younger Stars."

Team Teddy (Santino Marella, Booker T, The Great Khali, R-Truth, Kofi Kingston, & Zack Ryder) vs. Team Johnny (David Otunga, Jack Swagger, Drew McIntyre, Mark Henry, Dolph Ziggler, & The Miz)
"Mr. Excitement" only recently started showing up on TV, so I don't think he's leaving anytime soon. Meanwhile, Teddy Long has been around for years, during which time he's done pretty much the same thing week after week. I like Teddy and all, but I think his gimmick is way past its expiration date. It's time for a change in the management scene. Thus, I say the heels win this battle.

Intercontinental Championship: Cody Rhodes (c) vs. Big Show
WITMH?, Part 3. I would have much, much rather seen Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan culminate at Wrestlemania. You know, that interesting feud that they've been having for the past three months? The one that never really ended? The one that just kind of trailed off without Big Show ever getting his sweet revenge on the heel that had been antagonizing him for so long? That match would have made sense and it would have been backed up by a Wrestlemania-caliber storyline to boot. Big Show vs. Cody Rhodes was kind of rushed together and feels like it could have been any ol' Pay-Per-View match. Bleh. But whatever, predictions. I'll say Cody Rhodes because I look ahead to the post-Wrestlemania storylines and I don't really see Big Show doing anything with the IC title. Cody's title reign still has some legs to it. (That, and I have to admit that I just want to see him beat Honky Tonk Man's record for longest IC title reign. He still has a while to go, but hey, he just might do it.)

Triple H vs. The Undertaker
WITMH?, Part 4. I've said it before and I'll say it again: John Cena is the only remaining threat to Undertaker's streak. They should have just waited so we could see Undertaker vs. John Cena at next year's Wrestlemania. And don't tell me that Taker's body couldn't hold out for one more year. He doesn't wrestle anymore, so he'd be in no danger of breaking down between now and next year. Taker vs. Triple H, Part 3? Taker wins. Here's hoping this match is better than the snore-fest they had last year.

World Heavyweight Championship: Daniel Bryan (c) vs. Sheamus
WITMH?, Part 5. See my comments above about Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan. This is another match that feels like it could have happened on any ol' Pay-Per-View. It doesn't feel like a Wrestlemania world title match at all. Sheamus seems to be the obvious choice here, so I'll go with him.

WWE Championship: CM Punk (c) vs. Chris Jericho
Finally, a Wrestlemania-quality feud. This is my pick for Match of the Night. It's also the toughest match to predict since both outcomes make sense. I think Jericho will win the title from Punk in the end, but not yet. This is only the beginning of their feud. I say Punk retains tonight and loses the title to Jericho sometime over the summer.

The Rock vs. John Cena
When in doubt, pick John Cena.

[Crunkman2000]

World Heavyweight Championship: Daniel Bryan (c) vs. Sheamus
WITMH?, Part 5. See my comments above about Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan. This is another match that feels like it could have happened on any ol' Pay-Per-View. It doesn't feel like a Wrestlemania world title match at all. Sheamus seems to be the obvious choice here, so I'll go with him.

18 seconds.

18 freaking seconds?

Really? That... That actually happened. And with Daniel Bryan at that. So much for all that respect and skill he had prior to WWE. +sigh+ Thumbs up, creative dept.

Shocked Cena didn't DEFY THE ODDS again. Good to know someone up top os at least conscious to the fact that he's already hated enough. Putting him over the Rock would have caused a riot.

As for Taker-Trips: I agree, WITMH. Taker gains nothing but another win for the streak, and if Triple H would have won, well, there goes what could probably have been the biggest push you could EVER give someone - wasted on the boss' son-in-law, go figure.

Oh, and speaking of pushing older wrestlers who don't need it: Whoever greenlit putting the belt on Show needs to be punched. Really. Rhodes needed something to go off of, and like SE said, it would have been awesome to see him break Honky's IC streak. But nope, can't have that!

So I predict next year, they'll either put Cena over Taker (because he totally needs to be pushed more, amirite?) or they'll have someone newer (Rhodes, Punk, maybe even Daniel Bryan, should he recover from that squash?) end the streak. Or Taker will retire with the streak intact. Just don't do Trips/Taker again, please. Triple H REALLY doesn't need a goddang push.

[SnakeEyez]

18 seconds.

18 freaking seconds?

Really? That... That actually happened. And with Daniel Bryan at that. So much for all that respect and skill he had prior to WWE. +sigh+ Thumbs up, creative dept.
I hear ya. I was following the live results on Wrestleview, and when I read that, I just shook my head and went off to go cook dinner for half an hour since I was so disheartened. Even though I didn't think this match needed to happen in the first place (as I described in my last post), at least I could still focus on the silver lining: these two were snubbed last year at Wrestlemania, so at least they could make up for it by wrestling each other this year. And hey, it's Daniel Bryan and Sheamus, two of the best young stars in the business today. Both of these guys are incredibly talented. Even though the feud was pointless, at least they could still have a good match together, right?

Nope! We don't even get that much. And it's even worse because I've been reading interviews and stuff over the past few weeks, and Daniel Bryan and Sheamus have both said that they really wanted to steal the show at Wrestlemania. I'm sure neither one of them was happy to learn that they were being given less than 30 seconds to work with.

Shocked Cena didn't DEFY THE ODDS again. Good to know someone up top os at least conscious to the fact that he's already hated enough. Putting him over the Rock would have caused a riot.
Yeah, I was pretty surprised by that as well. I thought for sure it was going to be another "Pass the torch" moment where the old generation gave a big win to the newer generation (See Hogan vs. Rock from a few years back). I may not be a rabid Cena hater, but I am pleasantly surprised that Rock got the win nonetheless.

I think the real shocker of the night was Kane beating Orton. I mean, seriously, did anybody see that coming? I never would have predicted that outcome.

So I predict next year, they'll either put Cena over Taker (because he totally needs to be pushed more, amirite?) or they'll have someone newer (Rhodes, Punk, maybe even Daniel Bryan, should he recover from that squash?) end the streak. Or Taker will retire with the streak intact. Just don't do Trips/Taker again, please. Triple H REALLY doesn't need a goddang push.
Honestly, I'm not so sure Taker's even going to do anything at next year's 'Mania. I've always been under the impression that he was going to retire once he reached 20-0 at Wrestlemania. That's why I wanted him to sit out this one and just wait until next year so he could face Cena. But who knows, he might still keep going. I might be totally wrong about him retiring. Wouldn't be the first time.

And now, the hunt begins. If I'm lucky, I might be able to catch a video of CM Punk vs. Chris Jericho on YouTube before the WWE spots it and takes it down. That's the one match of the show that I really want to see.

[AlucardsFate]

So we decided to pay the outrageous price on account of our laziness. Whaddia gonna do?

That Daniel Bryan thing was...just...wow. Good thing they cut that short so they could have time for the Divas match eh? Lordy...

I am surprised as anyone that Kane won. I think it was an accident, I will go to my grave thinking that. But Rock beat Cena at least. A glimmer of hope to keep me watching. Though if Brian ends up being right and Cena goes off to end Taker's streak at some point in the future I just may have to stop watching wrestling forever....and ever. ....EVER.

Punk v Jerhico was good. Especially some of the sound bytes when you could hear them yell at each other. "TAP OUT YOU SON OF A BITCH!"

Overall it wasn't bad. First time it's felt like Wrestlemania in awhile to be honest, but I could have done without Brodus Clay anywhere near anything. He took a whole ten minutes to have a dance party with his "Momma" and a whole slew of other "Mommas." I was seriously considering suicide....

[Crunkman2000]

I've been hearing Taker wants to stick around at least another year - he's getting old, but he's got some fight left. Plus, the streak matches are sort of a tradition that a lot of people want to keep going a little bit further.

The Kane/Orton outcome makes me wonder what they're smoking in the writing dept. I don't see any sort of positive outcome - Kane is, as SE said, the go-to guy for putting newer talent over, and Orton, well, he's Orton - he's already a main eventer, I don't see why they'd pull this on us.

And Sheamus/Bryan brings back vague, terrible memories of this:

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In other news, Lesnar is supposed to come back tonight on Raw. Never really cared either way for him, but I'm still sorta intrigued by what they'll do with that.

[SnakeEyez]

Overall it wasn't bad. First time it's felt like Wrestlemania in awhile to be honest

Eh. I still wasn't feeling it this year. I mean, this year's 'Mania was definitely better than the trainwreck of a show they had last year, but I still couldn't really bring myself to get super hyped about it. Too many WITMH moments and too many throwaway matches. It felt like they focused all their attention on Cena vs. Rock and completely forgot that they still had three and a half hours to fill until about a month before the show.

[AlucardsFate]

I was delighted to read that Bret Hart (still my favorite) is as dissatisfied with the whole Daniel Bryan squash as everyone else. But all throughout WM and on Raw last night the crowd was chanting "YES! YES! YES!" in defiance. (Well they chanted "Si! Si! Si!" for Del Rio...which was amazing. But I guess Daniel himself addressed it after the show this is getting interesting. They can't ignore this, they'd be amazingly stupid to do so:
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[AlucardsFate]

Sorry I'm a bit late...had some things that required my attention. (Namely I passed out last night when I intended to sit down and do this...Hey, I'm exhausted)

ShinNatsume: 4-2
SnakeEyez: 17-4
AlucardsFate: 16-5
ChukoLiang: 6-4
escaped_shoplift: 0-6

Ugh, I think both Brian and I took a bit of a beating for WM. The gap is still narrow but our records have slight black eyes now. Anyway! This one kind of sucks, kinda up in the air, my hopes are not high for how this will turn out for me:

Extreme Rules:

United States Championship: The Miz vs Santino Marella (c)
Oh boy, Miz isn't even on the main show. A non-televised match for him. He's really getting punished isn't he? Either way I don't see him winning the freebee. Winner: Santino Marella

Divas Championship: Beth Phoenix vs Nikki Bella (c)
I'm not even sure what the angle is here. Why give her the title? I don't know what exactly to do here. Hell with it. I like Beth, I don't like other girl. Beth wins. Winner: Beth Phoenix.

Intercontinental Championship: Cody Rhodes vs Big Show (c)
Ahh the Wrestlemania rehash PPV. Most of these matches dont' go anywhere if history is any indication. This is here to fill time. Too bad, I really like Cody. Winner: Big Show.

(Falls Count Anywhere) Randy Orton vs Kane
Orton is going to get his over on Kane here so they can go one more for the proverbial "rubber match"Winner: Randy Orton

(World Heavyweight Championship 2 out of 3 Falls) Daniel Bryan vs Sheamus (c)
It goes without question that AJ is going to interfere in this match. But it what capacity? The interesting move would be for her to help Bryan win and take her place as the fully obsessed, crazy girlfriend. But more likely they will use this moment to go "Yeah female empowerment! and push her twoards the Diva's Title. She's gonna help Sheamus. Winner: Sheamus

(Extreme Rules Match) John Cena vs Brock Lesnar
Isn't this the same as Falls Count Anywhere? Or a Chicago Street Fight? It's all the same! Anyway, even after Edge's pep talk I still don't think the Cena falling from grace angle is done yet. And aside from that, Brock can't lose in his first match back. I'm gonna do the crazy thing... Winner: Brock Lesnar

(Chicago Street Fight WWE Championship) Chris Jericho vs CM Punk (c)
Another go round, with more comical promos and things going into it. This one is tough. Especially since when you go home, bad things tend to happen to you in the wrestling world. Either way I'm gambling but I'll follow the old rule of "You won the show before the PPV which means your going to lose" adage. Winner: Chris Jericho.

[SnakeEyez]

United States Championship: Santino Marella (c) vs. The Miz
Blargh. As much as I'd like to see Miz with a championship again, I just don't see the US title changing hands in a pre-show match that has received zero attention and no build-up at all.

Divas Championship: Nikki Bella (c) vs. Beth Phoenix
Kharma's coming back! And do you remember what she said last year right before she left? She told the Bella twins that she hoped they were still around when she returns so she could destroy them for bullying her. It makes sense for Nikki to hold onto the belt here so Kharma can snap her head off and take the title on Raw.

Intercontinental Championship: Big Show (c) vs. Cody Rhodes
I really have no idea where the Big Show/Cody Rhodes feud is going, so I guess I'll just stick with Show for now.

Falls Count Anywhere: Randy Orton vs. Kane
Kane won at 'Mania...somehow. I never would have predicted that outcome in a million years, but he did. If he wins here too, my head is going to explode.

2 Out of 3 Falls Match for the World Heavyweight Championship: Sheamus (c) vs. Daniel Bryan
I like Sheamus and all, but his title reign has been pretty lackluster so far. He needs a decisive win over Daniel Bryan here to get back on track. I just wonder what they're going to do with Bryan after this match. People keep cheering for him and chanting "Yes!" at him even though Vince McMahon insists that he's a heel. I wonder how long he's going to be able to ignore what the people want.

Chicago Street Fight for the WWE Championship: CM Punk (c) vs. Chris Jericho
Hmmmm. Hmmmm. I really can't justify this vote. I just don't know if it's time for Jericho to take the title yet. Maybe at the next PPV? We'll see how this rivalry develops. It definitely has enough fuel to last a little longer.

Extreme Rules Match: John Cena vs. Brock Lesnar
Yeah, it looks like they really are going with the "Fall from grace" route with John Cena. It makes sense since his loss to The Rock at 'Mania must have been devastating. He's already given Lord Tensai a pretty good rub, so I guess it's Brock's turn now. I'm actually pretty interested to see where they go with Cena after this. Surely they aren't going to have Cena go on a...losing streak, are they? Cena? Noooo.

[AlucardsFate]

Is she? I forgot all about Awesome Kharma. I thought that the Bellas were leaving anyway at the end of the month...

[SnakeEyez]

Is she? I forgot all about Awesome Kharma. I thought that the Bellas were leaving anyway at the end of the month...

According to Wrestleview, the Bellas' last day is tomorrow. I mean, I guess they could lose the title back to Beth tonight, but I think it makes more sense for them to drop the title to Kharma tomorrow night on Raw.

Then again, this is the WWE we're talking about here. They change their minds so often that nothing is ever set in stone.